One reason is that Epic are very dismissive of Linux, while Steam go out of their way to be supportive and GOG are supportive when it’s convenient
Another is trying to lock games into exclusives with them, which other distribution platforms don’t do so much
That said, if you don’t play games without cross platform multiplayer and don’t care about Linux support or see yourself caring any time soon, there’s not a huge reason to push you towards steam and away from epic. GOG is more of an anti-DRM thing, however barring sales the price and the cut for the devs is identical on all of them and it’s the same game aside from DRM.
for sure! steam liberated my machine from a windows dual boot partition. and made me go 100% linux all the time. gratitude is not really strong enough. it is more like when you have been captured, and then set free.
For me it’s entirely self-centered and I’m dispensing with all the aspirational and political feelings that people have about the way businesses operate.
Quite simply I recommend Steam because it is a product with so many killer features, it’s really hard to take anybody else seriously.
It’s just shy of 2024, and Epic is still a non-realized alpha product. Their website, store, and launcher/library is a perfunctory effort at best. The most recent feature they added that I even consider to be an improvement would be the ability to look at my own games library - that should sound like a pretty funny joke but it’s said deadpan. They don’t even have proper controller support for PC, whereas Steam for example recognizes that PC gamers come with a variety of input hardware.
I mean it’s so simply that steam is such a mature product that offers so much to the gamer, and epic just wants money and they’re not really doing anything to compel me to want to use that platform.
GOG is great, it’s a simple system that gives you the power to own your own games and I very much appreciate that. Personally I don’t like to splinter my collection across different services so I’m mostly avoid them but I can’t say anything really negative.
Anyways this is just my opinion, I feel like steam has tons of killer features, the otherS simply don’t. There’s lots of valid discussion in other areas about ethics and things like that but really I’m just looking at it from the perspective of what do I want from my money. Steam gives me the most, and the others don’t even hold a candle.
I try so hard to be a rational consumer and not an emotion-driven zealot for any company or product. I just look at Epic and what they tell and show gamers/devs/publishers about who they are as a company. They don’t hide it.
Epic doesn’t seem to add any killer (and at times rudimentary) features while they focus their pitch down to more money for publishers now but we own your soul; By comparison Valve says here’s a robust and trusted, feature-rich platform you can deploy upon and we’re improving it constantly.
Valve engages in continual expansion of their Steam ecosystem (look at the Deck alone and how much value that added overnight); Valve does continual short-lived research projects like the Steam Link / Steam Controller, which don’t survive as stand-alone products but pound one novel killer-feature after the next into the platform; Epic treats their product like an afterthought and their customers as wallets.
This is really what is at the crux of it. I am not sympathetic to Epic’s way of doing business where the customer is last, the developers and their art are the pawns, and publishers are plied with sweet, predictable short-money in exchange for souls.
I’ve seen enough enshittification to know at this point that doing business with a bean-counting, value-wringing company hurts us all, and perhaps I’m out on a limb here but I feel like this sentiment is becoming highly solidified among many.
The whole idea of digital licenses are stupid and risky. If you can find it on GOG, it’s preferable to get it there. The games are DRM-free, and you can directly download the installers and make an offline backup of them.
What if Steam went bankrupt, or start playing less nice?
Thankfully, there’s not too much reason to worry about this yet. Steam is a money-printing machine, and it’s not a public company or beholden to investors who demand increasing profitability every quarter. As long as Gabe Newell is still alive and doesn’t sell out by taking Valve public, things probably won’t change much.
It’s important to note that just because you got it on GOG does not guarantee it is DRM free but they do try. (Unless things have changed since I last looked)
This is where I’m often torn. My sentiments lean fully to the principle of the user owning his/her purchased software.
But I want Valve to have my money and I trust them, because their entire business model is giving me the power to play my games in the most ways possible, and in ways that having the OG installer on my Desktop can’t do.
I can stream my entire 900 game Steam library to my phone and when my Deck gets here I’ll have access to it all there as well. Muahahaha. Take my money. No GOG RAR Installer is going to give me that, ever. This doesn’t seem to get talked about enough. Valve adds so much value, they make it so I don’t even want to pirate.
I disagree, with or without taking bugs into consideration. It was a great experience and if you liked the base game you'll probably like the expansion too, if you didn't like the base game then you won't.
OK that’s your opinion. If you are poor and/or from a low income country that’s even understandable.
OTOH, 3 million people thought otherwise and bought it. Wake me up when you have made a game and an expansion for it for 3 people, let’s see how buggy those are. I will take the time to online shit-talk about those, too!
What is worth 30 dollars to you…? You said you’d have paid 15 for this, which is absurdly low in this day and age. A small expansion pack in the early 2000s would have cost more than that.
I think that 20 side missions and a bit more of story would have made this more acceptable. The base game is what 60 side missions for 60 bucks? Why should you get less value from this? Most of the work was already done
What a bizarrely corporate measure of quality this is… this is how you end up with mile wide, inch deep grind fests that just ooze “value” by pure volume. I think expecting this amount of content for $15 at this point just means that you can expect no content at all, because it won’t be commercially viable to keep all your dev teams spun up to work on it, along with patches.
There are a lot of games where a sizeable amount of players won’t have the initial achievements.
They may have just launched the game and never played it, achievements could have been added later on after the release like with Grand Theft Auto IV, some people only play multiplayer, or there may be something in place to disable achievements when you mod the game like in Fallout New Vegas.
Yup, the sample size is out of people who've booted up the game ever. So 13% of players downloaded it, installed it, thought about playing it, and didn't get much further than the menu screen. 7% of players of Fallout: New Vegas never finished the first mission.
or there may be something in place to disable achievements when you mod the game like in Fallout New Vegas.
This is why my achievements for Skyrim look completely incongruent with my play time. Someone might assume that I’d spent 700 hours in the character creator…
I didn’t realise Skyrim blocked achievements when modding, I’d definitely didn’t back in the day, it’s one of the few games that I have all achievements on and I’ve modded it to hell basically every time.
I think it didn’t used to either, as I have some achievements on the original version of the game, and I’m pretty sure I’ve never played it unmodded. But I have no achievements at all on the later editions, despite many, many hours of playtime.
Yeah, completely different markets. My friend bought the wrong one and for months he wouldn’t try outer wilds because it “wasn’t his sort of game” when it totally was.
the PC version is pretty fucked in the “feel great” department. the engine itself renders frames at arbitrary framerates just fine, but the animations (including the camera) only update at up to 60 FPS, with no in-game option to cap the frame rate to that animation rate. vsync doesn’t work properly with high refresh rates, and external framerate limiters aren’t able to get a good match. it’s borderline impossible to get this game to feel smooth with proper frame pacing, even with a vrr display.
best i could get was to use external tools to force the game to set my monitor to 60 hz, then turn on vsync in game, but this added a ton of input lag
Seems to me like Outer Wilds outshone Outer Worlds if anything. I never hear anyone talking of Outer Worlds anymore, but Outer Wilds is still brought up as one of the greatest indie games out there.
Mannnn. Outer Wilds is so freaking good. I had put it off for a while, but then last year I decided to go through it. It managed to be the perfect game at the perfect time. Raw intrigue and fascination turned into somehow helping me cope with the loss of my sister and dad who I had lost very recently at the time.
If they’re on Fandom, it’s because Fandom fucking sucks to work with. It sucks to view, and it sucks to edit. So I could understand people not wanting to deal with that shit.
They’re also still new and fairly large games. Unless the dev itself makes the wiki, they don’t usually have much content the first year or so of a game’s life.
It will move files to location you have set in category settings. If you are using sonarr it can automatically set tv-sonarr category and then qbittorrent will move it to your tv shows folder.
Check out Heroic Game Launcher. It works with GoG, handles GoG Galaxy Cloud Save support, and works with Proton (similar to Steam). A very good client.
As someone also using Linux, Steam has an official client, the workshop and is continuously advancing gaming on Linux. While GOG promised a native client years ago they haven’t delivered and Heroic has much fewer features than Steam.
Yeah, heroic is amazing and I really appreciate the amount of work that’s gone into it. It’s still much more convenient to buy direct from Steam and it rewards the company for the efforts to push gaming on Linux forward.
Are you sure you are addicted? I’m sorry, but to me it seems like you only have a problem with games that are deliberately designed to be addictive (WoW is basically a giant Skinner box, no wonder). In that case you would be just as susceptible to lots of things: like infinite-scrolling feeds on social networks, or recommendation algorithms on TikTok and YT.
Maybe if you find a way to filter out games that exploit your psyche for engagement, there will be a way to enjoy your very clearly beloved hobby in a healthy way?
Yeah it sounds to me like OP could get on fine if they restricted themselves to games where you pay once and get the whole game. No subscriptions, no microtransactions, no DLC. Also it might have been a mistake for OP to ask a gaming community about this
The premise itself is flawed, of course Gamepass impact sales, that’s the whole point. The question is does it negatively affect profit? Well for AAA games it might, for AA and indies it might affect positively and those make up the bulk of the gamepass library. Matter of fact there’s barely any AAA games released on GP that aren’t Microsoft’s own games.
I don’t have a game right now. I spent the weekend searching Gamepass and testing out some games I wouldn’t have bought blindly, trying to find my next obsession.
None have grabbed me yet. DOOM Middle Ages was starting to get fun but it kept crashing on me. Sorry developer’s, if your game doesn’t get my attention in the first ten minutes, you never deserved my money, but if I find the game on Gamepass and enjoy it, I tend to let others know.
With GP, I tend to dwell on older AA, indies games that I had my eyes on, but not committed enough to buy or good but too janky to spend money on. I found that I have more tolerance this way.
You don’t have to have an expensive PC, and even if you do, the amount you would save on software would far outweigh that cost in a year or less. And then every year after that, 6 bucks for 3 games dude
I mean from a consumer perspective no, but this isn’t something the consumer would even need to be concerned with. The conversation is from a business point of view.
AAA vs AA vs whatever else never had anything to do with business aside from marketing, and marketing doesn’t mean shit for the consumer if the game sucks. Just make a good game.
It describes the budget of the game. It’s always relative to the average budget in the industry but it is a business term.
I still don’t know why you keep bringing the consumer into this. The consumer doesn’t and should not care whether Gamepass hurts sales, only that it is a good deal for them. And it is. Whether sales are affected (obviously they are) is an industry conversation, but the real question is whether it boosts profitability or not.
Quality of games etc etc is all irrelevant in this specific conversation.
That’s the exact problem that we’re talking about.
Being so shortsighted for this quarters numbers, while also not giving a shit about the only thing that actually brings you money.
The consumer.
This is failing because business doesn’t take that into account, and down the line it absolutely plays a part. Let’s keep focusing on milking these 4 “AAA” franchises, and also buy up as many independent studios as we can just to shut them down, that surely won’t have an effect on the industry.
The consumer is the whole godamn point. You don’t get profit without them. They (we) smell this bullshit, and it doesn’t smell good.
It’s not a long term strategy and it never was supposed to be.
Edit: anytime I say you, I just mean companies, not you, I think thats obvious, but I just want to point out I’m not coming at you
I disagree, because fundamentally Gamepass is a great deal for consumers. And it’s also a good deal for developers if they know how to use it strategically. Like if your game came out a year ago, and its sales are stalling you can go to Microsoft and ask for a big lump sum, put your game there and stop worrying about month to month sales while you develop the next thing. People like me get to play a game they wouldn’t have never bought otherwise and they get the money to develop the next thing.
It’s not the best deals for all consumers, but it is for many. For example I don’t give a rats ass about owning a “library” because I very very rarely replay games, I have very little time for gaming and the type of game I prefer tend to be on the longer side. Gamepass is great because in between those 50+ hour games I have a large selection of games to choose from and I get to play a bunch of games that I wouldn’t have played otherwise because I wasn’t willing to pay $50 or more for them, like for example Lies of P. Then there’s the exclusive AAA from Microsoft which I happen to enjoy like Doom, Halo, and Gears of War. It saves me a lot of money.
Will Gamepass die at some point? Maybe. Probably. Nothing lasts forever. But there’s no signs that it is dying right now, nor that it is harming the industry at all. In fact it has allowed games that otherwise not see the light of day to become viable.
I’m a bit very hammered, let me get back to you here in a little while. Spoiler, I did read some of your first paragraph and I’m pretty sure there’s a middle ground coming up.
Oooo, still not ready to respond, but I did read all of it. Hit me up if you’re trying to get your shit ran in that gears remaster, I’m pretty stoked about that all irony aside.
I am tryina drink some water and rest a little bit but I promise I’ll get back to this thread. I appreciate you talking it out.
Yeah I don’t know where exactly I was going with that, but you’re right in the sense that for industry itself it’s good because it’s profitable. it makes sense, although there have been issues with large corporations like Microsoft shit canning everyone at the first sign of a new sparkly thing. Game pass can be and is beneficial in a lot of cases, but what it takes to create something like game pass and it be profitable has its downsides for people that work in the industry, studios that have been bought and abandoned, and in turn the consumers.
That’s the thing, for the big publishers, the end user (consumer) is only part of the puzzle. Investors and business partners (such as licensees) are more important, and have been for years. They bring in the wealth.
End users are neither organized nor informed enough to have a seat at the table. The masses will gravitate towards their big properties and marketing will be shaped to that effect. Acquire said big properties if you don’t have them, and make sure all the potential investors know you did.
I like indie games for walking sim and story heavy games only. Outside of that, 99% of indie games feel like some pixel art bs retro rip off roguelike nostalgia cash grab. I hate garbage ware like meatboy, etc.
If AAA studios weren’t so shitty, I feel like half of the indie studios wouldn’t have a chance.
Your opinion is valid, but “AAA” studios have lit themselves on fire, and a shit ton of objectively great games have come out and absolutely dunked on them.
A great example of this is balatro. It’s none of what you described, it’s nowhere near your typical cash grab AAA and it’s just a good game that did extremely well.
Another example would be Hades, just a monster of a good game.
Blasphemous 1 & 2, unknown studio, fucking killed it.
Also if you prefer not AAA games for story, what actually is a AAA game?
They need to bring back demos. It would help a ton if they did, but it seems so many companies and devs just completely skip the idea. I think some of it has to do with companies who kinda know their games aren’t going to be worth a fuck so they want people to buy at full price, so they’re not going to release a demo. Same with not releasing the game to reviewers early.
They could easily do so on a console or game streaming service, just give you like 2 hours and then switch it off.
I think Sony actually do that as part of one of the PSN tiers.
But I think the main driver behind no longer doing demos is that when they started analysing it, they found it mostly reduced sales. A lot of people were no longer interested enough to buy it after playing, at least not at full price. I gotta admit, back when demos were common on the front of magazines, there were very few that I actually purchased on the basis of the demo. The ones I did buy, I’d have probably got anyway, like Metal Gear Solid 2.
For a healthy mega publisher/platform with a lot of fingers in the pot? It will increase overall profits and, theoretically, those profits can be redistributed. This is effectively what EA did in the late 00s/early 10s where Madden and The Sims meant games like Mirror’s Edge (or… The Sims) could be created.
The problem being that once a few of the tentpoles collapse? it ALL collapses
Also, this ignores the companies that aren’t part of that megapublisher who now are fighting “just play Halo or Call of Duty, it is free with gamepass”. At best it creates an environment where it doesn’t really matter how well a game sells so long as you sold N licenses to Humble and MS and Sony and so forth. Which effectively incentivizes “streamer bait” games.
Also: We have seen exactly this play out in music and film/TV.
But Gamepass is not even close to being a tentpole. Halo and Call of Duty being in Gamepass has not limited the ability of games like BG3 being huge successes. If anything it frees up people to buy these type of games because their yearly COD is included in their monthly fee and now they can budget to buy other types of games.
Baldurs Gate 3? The game part of one of the bigger franchises in all of gaming (D&D) that is the sequel to one of the most celebrated franchises in all of gaming (Baldurs Gate) that had been in Early Access for years AND which was developed by one of the three best CRPG developers in all of gaming (Larian).
Well, you heard them: just make more Baldurs Gates!
Are you implying that the indie game industry is in any risk at all? Because that’s frankly hilarious. If anything like in music and movies (which is now also tv in a way), what’s more at risk are the big franchises. They’ve become unsustainable.
Gaming is going to look a lot more like the music industry looks now, with lots of indie companies doing great stuff and just a few huge artists making slop for the masses.
The “big franchises” that are how people find success in a gamepass world? Or do you still think that Dungeons and Dragons Presents Baldurs Gate 3 By Larian Studios is a tiny indie game?
Also: Maybe you should check out how the music industry is doing as countless artists talk about how hard it is to break out at all and one of the more popular bands on spotify (?) is literally AI slop?
Also
Are you implying that the indie game industry is in any risk at all?
Tell me you have ignored all the endless fucking layoffs without telling me you have ignored all the endless fucking layoffs.
If you want to discuss this? Either be open to learning or educate yourself ahead of time. But if you are just going to insist on vibes and how everything is going to just work out? You are wasting everyone’s time.
If you go back 20, 30 years ago you would never be able to make a living as a musician in an indie project. Nowadays you have an amazing and frankly mind blowing amount of very talented artists making wonderful and unique music that also affords them a living. I love music man, so I know that it’s never been a better time to be a fan of music especially if you like stuff that breaks boundaries. There is more difficulty becoming huge, but again that’s how it works now. huge artists like Taylor Swift, Beyoncé etc are basically a dying breed. The AI slop thing is more about chillhop artists etc having difficulty because their music is not differentiated in any way and the people who listen to it are not actually looking at who the artists is 99% of the time. Artists will have to adapt and make music that is more unique now instead of hoping that they get on the queue of people who are not paying attention to what they are listening to.
The layoffs are proof of what I’m saying. Huge studios with thousands of employees are no longer sustainable, therefore they need to shed weight. The era of AAA 500million+ budget video games is coming to a close. More studios will close, more people will lose their jobs. From there a lot of smaller companies will spring up and that will be the gaming environment for the next 10 years or so.
I’ve been gaming all my life, I turned 30 recently. And I think the last 5 years have been some of the best the industry has ever had, and it was all thanks to the indie scene and the AA scene. There has never been more variety at this level of quality ever before, that’s for sure. The only thing that may come close was the 90s when you basically had a similar scene to what we have now.
All of this to say that from the perspective of the consumer, gaming/music/movies and tv are fantastic right now. But it’s become much more atomized, you have lots of niche shows, music acts and videogames as opposed to what we had before were there were a lot of larger properties but they all were a little dumbed down because they had to appeal to a large demographic within its niche.
The people who most praise Gamepass are indie developers. All the time. The ones that complain the most are the AAA studio employees for a reason, it threatens their entire model.
Does it suck for the developers, yes, I feel for them. But this is the market shifting to reflect consumer behavior and preference.
Edit: Btw it really shows you haven’t even looked at gamepass, because it hardly has any AAA games that are not MS properties. And the ones it’s has are quite old. So it’s not how people find success in Gamepass, at all.
I don’t necessarily hate dual bars. What I do hate is burning all my ultimates or potions or whatever to take that last chunk of health off to secure the kill. Realizing I now have to kill the boss again yet without those extras, is what kills me.
If I’m lucky I can find something new to hyperfixate on to get me out of a rut. Old stuff doesn’t do it for me. Discovered my favorite genre this way actually.
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