Bethesda, simply put, doesn’t know how to react to criticism. Instead of taking this feedback and improving their product they double-down and insist that you should like it because they said so. If it’s boring it’s boring man. They are simply as disconnected as possible. Remember the whole canvas bag fiasco? Then they said “ah, canvas costs too much, we aren’t planning on doing anything with the nylon one”… deal with it in other words. Then they were puzzled why people disliked them to all hell.
I can’t believe how ignorant you are of the worldwide canvas shortage of 2018. Canvas became a global strategic resource. Lack of canvas destabilized numerous nation states.
The idea of frivolously wasting that precious canvas on a video game trinket is frankly offensive.
Yup. And shitty plastic shell for the rum. Then people who requested refund got their info and CC numbers leaked by their system which they took offline immediately.
I’m not 100% sure but I think FO76 is maintained by BGS Austin. They seem to be far more interested in taking feedback and making the game better than the main Bethesda studio. FO76 may be fundamentally flawed but post-launch it’s definitely getting more care than Skyrim, FO4 and Starfield combined.
They also took class action lawsuits for that game as well, so that might be affecting that push to fix the game. But even if they fix it, doesn’t negate the fact they said they don’t plan on fixing canvas issue, or any problem they caused. Only when there was an outrage they reacted. Remember the horse armor for Skyrim or when they tried to sell mods that were included in previous game. I do.
Given how many features use generative AI to build user-generated content I would say mark this moment. There is a future of slop-centric Roblox stuff everywhere and this may well be where it starts.
I'm not as mad about that as most will be, but... yeah, I've mentioned a couple of times around here how weird it is that nobody is really bringing it up so far.
I appreciate it more because it’s generative AI based off of user created content and their own content. I respect that more than using outside sources that got their training data from god knows where and just slap that shit in there and call it a day.
How is it based on UGC if the game wasn't out when they implemented the GenAI? As far as I can tell they're using a whole bunch of ML-based tools built on Unreal tech for animation and model creation and what seems to be run of the mill Gen AI for textures. I could be wrong, but hey, I'll hold you to that being cool when EA or Ubisoft show up with their version of the same thing.
You can enter a text prompt and they spit out a texture based on it, which sure seems to just be a good old image generation model. They do generate mesh from images, which probably has some ML involved, although it's harder to tell how much is just good old photogrammetry, and they do face and body animation from video source. I think that's all part of the Unreal Engine 5 metahuman package, which I'm pretty sure does use some machine learning. Oh, and I am pretty sure a bunch of the writing and character AI has been machine-created, be it in real time or baked offline.
Part of the problem is that people aren't super clear on what "AI" is supposed to mean, so it's hard to know what they're supposed to be angry about. The texture generation thing at least is clearly in the GenAI danger zone.
I’ve mentioned a couple of times around here how weird it is that nobody is really bringing it up so far.
How many people are actually playing the game to find out though? I’m always strongly suspicious every time some new game explodes onto social media. Why couldn’t they use AI to generate user reviews and comments also?
There’s a lot of suspiciously crap games that manage to explode to the top of the steam trending list. I’ve been bitten before.
This one has art that looks so generic I can’t even tell if they’re screenshots or promo pics unrelated to the game. It suddenly makes sense now I know it’s genai. It’s not trying to communicate anything to a user it’s just vibes man.
No no it’s good, this is actually better than them making a proper announcement. Community loves this shit.
Quick summary:
Dev changes name, handle, and pfp on twitter. Posts a cryptic message about keeping your eyes closed tomorrow.
Reverse image search of pfp leads to a recipe released April 2nd
Cryptic message appears to be a reference to an Imagine Dragons thing from April 2nd
“Tomorrow” was interpreted as being related to the big switch 2 reveal, launching April 2nd
The name and handle also appear to be references to things having to do with April 2nd
The community is ablaze right now. Without a hint of irony: there is more genuine belief in the game actually coming out this time than there was before the original delay was announced in 2023, back when we had an official release date
I have a hard time accepting the way social media works. The whole chain of logic you just spelled out makes me want to vomit. I don’t want to have my strings pulled, my chain yanked, or my goose got. I want to be talked to like I’m a person, and I know it’s just going to keep happening less and less and one day it’s going to do my head in.
I get that, but you’re also not quite getting the full picture with this specific instance. The community on Reddit has been waiting for Silksong so long that they have been over-analyzing every single game convention for years to see if we’re going to get a release date, and had a heated debate over whether or not a blood sacrifice of a member of the community would bring the release. They’re a little crazy over there.
The context only increases the granularity of my distaste. We live in a society of conspiracism and forgetful unthinking chaos. I don’t want to read entrails for clues about the future, I want to wait patiently for a good game and not become schizophrenic trying to connect meaningless dots.
I don’t want to read entrails for clues about the future
But, you don’t have to. This is them hinting about a upcoming announcement of a release date. For the average player like you and me, it’s just the announcement itself that we need, and we’ll get that.
Just… don’t pay attention to it? It’s something that interests other people. Imagine if somebody said that about something you liked that they had no interest in.
The silksong community is one of my favorite of all time for years now. Every couple of weeks a new “theme” of insane shitposting evolves. Most fun and creative silly posting I’ve ever seen.
One common post is “_____ every day until silksong comes out”. People are doing fanart challenges, one guy posts a video of himself petting a cat every day which is very popular. The cat had to get a surgery at one point and needed a cone but was fine.
It’s not just noise. It brings people a lot of joy. There’s been several posts over the years from people basically grieving the potential loss/change of the community once the game actually drops. I’ll miss it, too
Tbf there are a lot of people who love solving cryptic puzzles and getting info out of very little, thats why ARGs are a thing. The good thing is, you don’t have to engage, you can just wait for proper announcements but for the people who love this shit they get to have fun, and presumably the devs too for making it.
And imo it shows that team cherry is interacting with the community in a positive way and might actually be finishing the game
It’s not for “normal” people, it’s for die-hard fans in their community, a little brain teaser / clue hunt. For the rest of us, there’ll be a proper announcement and a trailer.
Then don't engage with it lol? You are free to wait for proper official announcement or confirmation of the game instead of being here discussing a cake picture
Don’t get me wrong, I sincerely hope it does come out soon! But I’ve been on the hype train long enough to no longer get my hopes up. Instead, I’ve reached the true hype nirvana: There is no Silksong. There never was any Silksong. It’s merely a collective delusion.
It would be quite funny then to have them shadow drop it on april 1 with people freaking out about trying to tell others only be be met with disbelief as credibility of any statement about game release was already heavily compromised. Bonus point if they add 'coming soon" to logo on steam page for that day.
Well it must have worked. All I heard for months when it came out was how bad everything about it was, then I finally got it myself and it quickly became one of the top favorite games of my life. Sorry for everyone who had a bad experience because I loved it so much.
I thought it was okay. It fizzled out pretty quickly for me as it felt half-baked and overly "gamey", which kept breaking the immersion illusion for me. I never did finish it. But I started over when Phantom Liberty dropped last week and it feels soooo much better. The immersion doesn't feel like it's being killed by a thousand cuts... everything feels more natural and believable now. It still has it's gamey moments, but they are a lot less obvious now.
I’m playing for the first time, amd my only real gripe is I wish the gorgeous cyberpunk world were more like Yakuza, with a million random minigames. Other than that, it’s been a blast.
The main story was pretty good, especially the Panam ending, which should have been the successor to Fallout: NV imo. Easily could have been it’s own game, excellent, 8/10.
I picked it back up in the post game after the skill tree rebalance and tried to get the highest heat level possible with the cars with guns on them, but the police kept getting lost, which decreased my heat level. Max tac couldn’t find me in a big intersection. I dejectedly uninstalled the game and decided to play something else. The red engine just can’t handle hazard level 5 interactions that well :/
I also played a quest, but it was just a “find a dead body” radiant quest for which I got about $2,500. I want more main storyline and less paper mache missions. The art direction and main storyline(s) are strong, but everything else feels really mushy to me. Witcher 3 was pretty solid all the way through.
When the game first came out you could walk around the corner to hide from the police. And none of the NPCs knew where any of the roads were, so they were just scrape along the side of building for no reason at all.
Yes and no. The AI is significantly better… but it’s still not great. Case in point: cops will chase you now, but it doesn’t take long to get a feel for how to fudge their pathing and lose them.
I played it on PC at launch and thoroughly enjoyed it. They’ve completely redone the skill tree system and reworked a ton of the weapons/clothing/cyber gear. It’s different now, but the story and core gameplay are still very much the same. I’m replaying it for the DLC and having a great time.
If the promotion of mtx.is jarring or overwhelming then even limiting to cosmetics sucks. If something ends and there are multiple click through screens encouraging players to by mtx and other ads within the game to buy the mtx it can become a chore to ignore. Even if gameplay itself is not impacted, the things that happen outside of gameplay can deag down the whole experience.
An example would be those stupid unskippable season pass screens where the bar goes up slowly and it reminds you of what you didn’t get becsuse tou didn’t buy the season pass. A few seconds each time, sure, but it adds up and is clearly trying to goad you into spending money. That shit sucks even if it limited to cosmetics.
I would rather pay $60 to own and be able to fully play the game. However, my response came from my perception of surprise and doom-and-gloom by the community when we already knew it would be free-to-play.
If a game is going to have mtx, they shouldn’t be charging for it during a prerelease. They have multiple ethical ways to handle it that would garner better feedback.
Leave it out entirely and focus on the gameplay. That is what should be selling the game anyway.
Have the mtx but without a way to pay real money. Give the players the option to ‘purchase’ in game currency and give them a running total.
The latter would be reset at release, but would gather feedback on what people want to spend and if the promo process is well implemented.
Both would run counter to the actual purpose of the vast majority of mtx which is fleecing whales and this is EA.
The most ethical implementation of mtx that I know of is actually for a paid game, Helldivers 2. The in game promo stuff is minimal and does not negatively impact the menus or interacting with the ship. The option to buy stuff doesn’t use dark patterns, but it is easily available. When they did set prices too high for a collaboration thing they apologized due to feedback and gave the other half of the stuff that would have been for sale to every single player. It is basically the exact opposite of Call of Duty’s mtx.
My guess is that there is only one skate park and simple character creation that is free for everyone. Everything else is behind paywall. Want pink shorts and green hair? want to skate around the city or in new park? want a new deck? open the wallet.
I’m not saying don’t try it, because some people do like it, but I don’t think Starfield will ever be worth the time it takes to play, let alone having to pay for it too. It absolutely does not respect the player’s time, and there’s no content in it that I saw that’s worth playing. I didn’t see anything when I played, but I think I’ve seen just about everything after watching a stupid number of videos discussing the game. None of it is particularly interesting (in fact, I think most of it is fundamentally uninteresting because they weren’t willing to ask how their universe could be different from our own).
BG3 though is absolutely worth playing whenever you decide to play it. I don’t think it’s getting a DLC because Larian said they’re working on something new and unrelated now, but it’ll probably still see some patches and the price will come down, as well as more mods being available.
I recently bought the OG Dragon’s Dogma for $6. There are a ton of QoL and fun mods that improve gameplay, no DRM crap, and the game performs really well overall. Zero reasons IMO to buy DD2 right now and put up with an inferior experience and Denuvo.
I mean personally I wouldn’t want to game like that on my phone, as it will almost certainly kill the battery and I need my phone for… well phone things.
But I don’t really see why it being $60 is at all weird. It’s a $60 AAA game everywhere else too. Same game as it is there.
Edit: and it also unlocks the game on m1 or newer iPads and macOS devices… really not seeing why this is so egregious. It’s $60 on steam too
Yeah honestly the idea that a port should cost less because it’s a worse experience is stupid. As long as effort was put in and the game is still playable and as enjoyable an experience as other platforms whoever made it has any right to charge what they see fit for that platform.
Now should people buy it? Probably not and if it doesn’t run as well you can absolutely raise the argument of it was a pointless cash grab anyways but…
Being upset that a developer wants to get paid for a game no matter what platform they put it on… not a big deal
you gotta take into account that the conceptual design phase has been completely eliminated from the process. And lots of the core logic would've been ported over wholesale. one example you can find is searching about the code in the katamari ports, where there's parts of the code left behind that don't do anything, and point to ps2 libraries that don't exist in Unity.
while there's nothing revealed here on how much is just copy/pasted over, I'm sure they'd be motivated to bring over as much as they can when they were initially estimating the work needed for the project, and then test the hell out of it. A majority of the graphics engine would probably have to be remade if they didn't aim to emulate it, and would be one of the major challenges in a mobile port of a higher-end console/pc game, but the assets/resources would be copied over and no work on that beyond ensuring it looks fine on the target resolution and framerate; maybe even with the use of automated AI upscaling/downscaling to reduce that workload even further. I find it safe to assume a straight port doesn't usually require the same or more amount of work as the original
Yup the switch mortal Kombat 1 port likely used a tool to just downgrade and straight port the game over and this it didn’t actually run particularly well and was a stupid and low effort port… but someone still made that game before that was done.
So if they want to shoot themselves in the foot and cripple their own launch and game with bad performance that’s their own issue and one that is a separate conversation to them charging what they think is appropriate for their brand new game.
that's kinda the crux of my spiel though, what they charge communicates what they believe the work is worth, and they're either saying the previous work is worth less now, or this lesser amount of work is worth more
I agree, they have the right to charge what they want, but what they communicate with the price feels like spitting in the face of their playerbase, which, again, they have the right to do
and yeah, MK1 on switch is rough, and feels like they just ported over as much of the graphics engine as they could, and completely turned off all the fancier effects. Then they downscaled all the assets on top of that to make it super oof
Exactly, people have been buying worse switch ports for higher prices than the PS/XB versions for the portability for years now, phones shouldn’t be different if it’s a playable port optimised for them.
I understand your perspective, but the way I see it, it’s like renting a movie at home versus seeing it in a theater. For some people, the extra money to go to a theater is worth it. I’m not paying $20+ to see a movie once at home though, and especially not to see it on my phone. Discounted price for a discounted experience. If they want to charge $20 for the mobile version, and $40 for MacOS, then I’d be way more likely to try a triple-A game on a phone.
But you get it with no compromises on MacOS, so why would they discount the price there? This is buy once, play "anywhere" (anywhere that's good for Apple). You don't pay less for a game you only play on a Steam Deck either.
Sure, then $20 for the mobile app, and $60 for MacOS (which should include a mobile copy). That would work for me too. I don’t have a Steam Deck, but I for sure would not pay full price for a game just to play on the Steam Deck.
I think the Switch and the Steam Deck have shown that portable games are worth every bit as much as non-portable, but in both of these cases, they output easily to the larger experience at home. I think Apple is providing that too. $60 still makes sense to me, since you're always buying the MacOS version which includes a mobile copy, which you said was acceptable.
What if you don’t have a Mac though, the MacOS copy is going to waste. I think Nintendo games are far too expensive as well. I own some, but I’m not happy with the price of the games (my kids love them though).
It's not a Mac OS copy and an iOS copy any more than I have a Steam Deck copy of a game and a desktop copy of a game. From what I can tell, it's the same thing. Obviously this is beneficial for Apple keeping you in their ecosystem, but this serves the same function. Quite frankly, I'm not sure why you'd have an iPhone if you don't have a Mac, but I know plenty of people do.
I’m not sure why you’d have an iPhone if you don’t have a Mac
iPhones outsell MacBooks something like 10:1. The majority of people with iPhones, if they are playing games not on their phone, are using consoles and/or PC’s.
I guess that depends. A lot of flagship phones are reaching $1k+ these days, and I rely on my phone for a TON of things. I need the support, battery life, and I enjoy the Apple ecosystem (not just my MacBook, but the watch and AirPods too). I’ve found it made sense for me. I guess the value of things really depends on the buyer’s perspective.
Wait, so you do have a Macbook. Maybe it's not M1, but if you enjoy that part of the ecosystem, you'll probably upgrade to one at some point. At which point, that gives you a "Mac copy" of the game too.
Oh, yeah. Sorry if I didn’t mention that. I have an M1 Pro. I still wouldn’t play the game on my MacBook. I have an ultra wide screen and there’s no way my Mac would run the game well. I have a gaming desktop that is much more suitable for desktop gaming.
Heh, honestly, this is the problem with Apple's value proposition when it comes to gaming. You'll see elsewhere in this thread that I don't think Apple has shown they know how to really make a solid gaming offering, and this is a large part of why.
Yeah, the confusion by everyone around this pricing is really counterintuitive.
The product is exactly the same as its console / PC counterpart.
How well it runs on Apple products remains to be seen.
I for sure would not opt for it since I have a high end gaming PC.
Also, especially considering how Apple pulls products from their stores w/o refund…
I do hope that this sells somewhat well and opens the door for more developers to release their games on iOS / Mac.
I still think that Apple could build a proper gaming rig / console, but are in the chicken / egg situation still.
Apple is no doubt considering moving more heavily into the gaming space. They’re looking for more revenue streams to keep feeding the corporate fantasy of perpetual growth, and there are only so many sweat shop laborers they can exploit. Wouldn’t surprise me at all for them to buy a publisher like EA and create some steam competitor (or just leverage the Mac app store).
This is what MS are gearing up to fight with their acquisitions and infrastructure. If you can buy a game on iTunes and it works across your Mac, AppleTV, iPhone, etc, then they need to have the same in the Xbox brand across console, PC, cloud, etc. Sony are only now putting games on PC years late and that business model is looking tired already, multi device is the future.
It’s a compelling proposition, and not one Microsoft can compete with. At least not in the mobile/tablet space. Cloud gaming is all well and good, but native hardware will always be superior. Microsoft is crazy not to be considering a 1st party handheld like the steam deck. Or at least a gaming-centric UI for small screen devices. Even just integrating something like the Xbox UI would be an improvement.
I think they’re banking on the handheld PC market picking up for that. Obviously Steamdeck was a non-starter for native as it uses Linux, but they threw their weight behind the ROG Ally and packaged that with several months of Gamepass.
That’s pretty good. Play anywhere across an ecosystem is always the right move. Sony expecting people to double dip on PS5/PC releases is going to look pretty old pretty soon.
I wonder if anybody remembers when it leaked Microsoft had a concept of a plan about restrictions on Xbox discs (used/shared), everyone gasped, Sony mocked them in a video about “sharing discs” on PS4 and became a turning point in the console wars…
Even a decade later: Remove discs at your peril! Half the reason I’ve even bought consoles is for Blu-ray movies (still unbeatable AV quality). Sony won both the console and disc drive wars FFS! Still not enough. “Line must go up more!”
I hope MS is at least mocking them back right now, for giggles. Before announcing a very similar thing next year…
Yeah. It’s crazy to think that USB can now handle 240W. And yes, the naming conventions are terribad but, at least the standards are actually open, unlike VESA’s.
They are doing this because a rotten corpse doesn’t force them to compete, they can do whatever they want. If MS didn’t shit the bed with the Series X/S, Sony would be trying harder to please customers, or at least not actively screwing them (see also: 800 EUR PS5 Pro without disc drive or vertical stand).
Sony would rather flush hundreds of millions of dollars down the drain that was Concord than give fans one of the easiest layups imaginable by putting Bloodborne on PS5 and PC
First time I played WoW I liked that you were given a guided tour of your races homeland as it explained the world. The last time I played WoW I had to to a tutorial island that explained nothing about the world and then dumped me in an expansion with characters I had no fucking idea who they were and why I should care about them. Even ESO doesn’t prevent new players from playing the base storyline and FFXIV still requires you to complete ARR before moving to the first expansion. I dropped WoW pretty quickly again because I felt too lost.
I started playing recently ish having never played WoW before, and good god the intro feels practically designed to drive new players away. The tutorial was so tedious and boring and taught me so little about how to actually play that I’m still not even entirely sure what I’m really supposed to do or how to even begin to understand the story/timeline. The game as a whole just feels so needlessly difficult and obtuse, I’ve ended up really just logging on every once in awhile for events to grab any cute pets or whatever mounts the game will graciously allow me to get without buying a sub
Wait, they just give you mounts now? You used to have to wait until level 20 to buy a mount. Level 20 took forever, and then you could only buy the slow mount for your race. You didn’t get a fast mount until level 40, which took a very long time. Then you had to grind reputation for different factions to buy their expensive mounts. Some rare mounts could be found through seasonal events or in raids. I ran Tempest Keep every week for 2.5 years before I finally got Ashes of Al’ar to drop for me.
You used to have to wait until level 20 to buy a mount. Level 20 took forever, and then you could only buy the slow mount for your race. You didn’t get a fast mount until level 40, which took a very long time.
Ha, rookie numbers. In my time you had to wait for level 40 to buy your slow mount. Fast mounts were bound to level 60 I believe and were insanely expensive (I sold so much stuff in the auction house to get the money together in those days). Around level 20 or 30 Hunters got an aspect which increased their running speed and druids could shapeshift to travel form.
Correction: final fantasy xiv requires you to play ALL of the story to get to the rest of the playerbase, which is, and I’m not exaggerating, probably 700 hours
Oh yeah it’s a slog, the great divider that everyone has to overcome. They need to do another pass on reducing the amount of stuff and one of the problems is that buried in the trivial ARR stuff is some important information for later. It’s sadly in a state of “just wait, it gets good after the first season”.
I know. It’s the only MMO I stay actively subscribed too. I pre-ordered endwalker digital collectors edition and will be doing the same for dawntrail. It’s one of my favorite games.
You are exaggerating. You can complete the entire MSQ up to EW in less than 3 days in-game playtime. Source: You can find raiders with alts that have sprout icons, and I’ve done it myself twice.
But I get it, you need to know exactly what to do and skip cutscenes. You also can’t do any side questing and once you leave an area, never look back. Which most would rightly criticize me for suggesting. The story is good.
Honestly, if the concern is anything other than the story, it’s probably not the game for you anyways.
I’d also like to point out that most content is built to be relevant, so you’ll be doing content with the rest of the player base in just a few hours of playtime. We have the opposite queue problem in contrast to other games: You aren’t waiting for other new players to show up to complete content; you are waiting for the servers to fit you into a party that hundreds of other players of various levels want to also do.
Same for me, I wanted to introduce someone into WoW during COVID and for nostalgia reasons, only to see that they took away the adventure and exploration and transformed it into a soulless husk. I dropped it immediately.
You seem to be knowledgeable about FF so I ask, is it a good time to start playing? I feel like there’s a lot to get through before I can get current in time for the new expansion. Is there something I can boost like in wow to get current. Without that then while I can afford it, it still feels bad to pay a sub for old content ya know.
No. No way to skip the story as far as I’m aware and it’d be a bad idea honestly as the story continues right from ARR to all the expansions, endwalker has a lot of callbacks to everything before it as it’s a swansong of something like 8 years. Dawntrail is the first new major story arc since FFXIV’s release. Leveling isn’t so bad currently because it’s boosted to get as many people to 90 as much as possible but there’s no max level item either as far as I’m aware as you pick a class then that class becomes a specialisation so you’re constantly getting new abilities to learn for your rotation. It would defeat the point of learning your specialisation if you skipped the leveling and quests of it to max level and had everything unlocked.
However, you will have no idea how mechanics work, and you will frustrate both yourself and team mates. This could even get you reported as trolling in extreme cases.
Edit: it also only skips one expansion at a time, and at $11 USD per expansion, that’s $44 and you STILL only get to Endwalker. No skip for that yet, although I bet there will be when Dawntrail drops. Still, why pay $55 to skip the game? That’s insane.
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