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Getallen, w I wonder why Godot and Unreal are getting so much interest today

Well thats another company imploding on itself, really colors you surprised, sinks you, causes your submarine to turn into a crushed soda can.

nanoUFO,
@nanoUFO@sh.itjust.works avatar

It’s what happens when you make a company public and all they want is return on their investment yesterday.

sugar_in_your_tea,

That’s a leadership issue though. The CEO’s job is to communicate expectations to the board and balance long term and short term returns.

Da_Boom,
@Da_Boom@iusearchlinux.fyi avatar

Except a lot of companies and investors don’t really care about long term profit anymore anyway.

sugar_in_your_tea, (edited )

That’s a popular quip, but it’s just not true. If it were, Unity would lay off most of its staff and only do bug fixes. That way they’d save a ton on salary, and they probably wouldn’t lose any customers for a couple years until they fall far enough behind, so their quarterly financials would look great for about a year until they started losing customers.

This isn’t that. This is just a classic example of the leadership not understanding the business they’re in and trying to maximize profit. I think they overestimate the value of their product and what their customers are willing to pay for.

Pxtl, (edited ) w I wonder why Godot and Unreal are getting so much interest today
@Pxtl@lemmy.ca avatar

People switching to Unreal are like the ex-Twitter users who went to Tumblr and Threads.

nothingcorporate,

Certainly Godot is the safer bet (probably why they are surging so much more right now), but Unreal is nowhere near as bad as Threads. Unreal is open source, and the license specifically forbids Epic from making retroactive changes like Unity just did:

  1. The Agreement Between You and Epic

a. Amendments

If we make changes to this Agreement, you are not required to accept the amended Agreement, and this Agreement will continue to govern your use of any Licensed Technology you already have access to.

driving_crooner,
@driving_crooner@lemmy.eco.br avatar

I was really confused because from some reason I was thinking that Unreal and Unity were the same.

sugar_in_your_tea,

Unreal is not open source, it’s source-available. Open source generally gives freedoms like redistribution, yet that is explicitly not allowed by Unreal. To get access to the source, you need to agree to a licensing agreement with them.

That said, source-available is a lot better than most proprietary software licenses.

raptir, (edited )

You’re confusing “free” (as in freedom) with open-source.

ETA: you’re correct that Unreal is source available, but a lot of what you listed is not required to be open source.

jack,

Are you stupid? Read the definition of open source

sugar_in_your_tea,

What did I mention that’s not part of the open source definition? Btw, I’m using this one, and only mentioned redistribution, which is the first one:

The license shall not restrict any party from selling or giving away the software as a component of an aggregate software distribution containing programs from several different sources. The license shall not require a royalty or other fee for such sale.

The next big part is able derivative works, which is also not allowed as part of the Unreal license AFAIK.

jack, (edited )

This is the only definition and @raptir clearly hasn’t read it before trying to correct you.

jack, (edited )

Source-available is just as bad as proprietary as it distracts from the freedom that open source/free software gives. It also undermines open source by confusion which you are trying to clear up right now. Don’t legitimize source-availability

sugar_in_your_tea,

That’s only true if you’re talking about the goals of open source/free software generally.

If we’re just talking about a game engine and releasing games, being able to modify the engine is absolutely critical when optimizing a large game. So having source available is absolutely a very practical thing when using proprietary software.

So it really depends on what you’re concerned about. Source available is just as good as open source in most cases if your goal is to build closed source software. If your goal is to build open source/free software, it’s awful.

jack, (edited )

In most cases you are NOT allowed to modify source-available code, just to look at it

sugar_in_your_tea,

I’m pretty sure you can always modify code for personal use, you just can’t always distribute those changes. In the case of a game engine, this would mean you could modify the engine code in development, but you could not release your game with those changes in.

Unreal allows modification and distribution, but only if you’re a licensed user and only for your combined work, but you cannot distribute your own fork of Unreal, aside from a patch set for other developers.

jsh, w Unity will quietly waive controversial fees if developers switch to its ad monetisation service - report

So scummy of them.

FrankTheHealer, w Horizon Forbidden West Complete Edition is reportedly coming to PC

Awesome. I played the first one on PS4 and was blown away.

Would love to replay that and FW on Steam Deck

AllonzeeLV, w Starfield user score drops to "mostly positive" on steam

Modern gamers are self-destructive. Nothing is good enough, and because every AAA release gets torn down and review bombed in one way or another, most and eventually all games from developers with the resources to make something of scale will become pay to win, microtransaction based garbage.

Because if they can’t please their audience and lose all passion for the craft because of it, they’ll just say fuck it go straight for the credit cards of those that do show up.

I’ve played about 70 hours so far. If you like the genre but starfield doesn’t wow you, I don’t think you’re able to be pleased. Is it perfect? No. Is it at absolute minimum an A grade? Absolutely.

GregorGizeh,

I agree that we should appreciate well made games. But those are already beloved all around and praised at every turn, I don’t know how the people could be more supportive.

Think BG3, think Elden Ring. Even CP77, after a very rough release, is in a pretty good state now and about to receive a dlc + update that delivers many things originally promised; allowing the developer to recuperate a lot of the lost good will with the customers.

The point is, people still love good games. Just that starfield is pretty mediocre. Not a bad game by any means, but it feels like a lot of compromises, loading screens and reused assets.

sugar_in_your_tea,

One of the major disappointments imo is that space isn’t interesting. You only really go there for the odd ship battle to progress the plot or whatever, but you can’t really fly between planets, so you miss out on the cool side stories you get with Elder Scrolls games by walking between cities. I was hoping for Firefly the Bethesda game, but it’s just Skyrim stretched across planets that you fast travel between.

I want to find ships in distress, pirate outposts among asteroid fields, scuttled ships I can scavenge, etc. In other words, space should be a mechanic, not just a setting.

I think the planets are fine, but I’d rather have fewer, more densely populated planets. I don’t think space-colonizing people would only make 3-4 settlements per planet, there would be dozens if not hundreds of settlements before moving to the next planet. I’d rather buy a DLC to get access to more systems then current setup where everything is spread out. In fact, just give me Sol with Earth, Mars, and maybe one of a Jupiter’s moons being inhabited with the rest working like the planets in Starfield.

But no, it’s just Skyrim set it space, with fast travel between cities. That’s fine, just not particularly special. I may play it at some point, but it’s not what I’m looking for right now.

neokabuto, (edited )

The scale is definitely too big. I’m pretty sure most of the systems are pretty much there just to fill in the star map. I’d rather have a setting where maybe interstellar FTL requires a sublight trip first so only the nearest few stars to Sol are accessible. Really I just want Everspace 2 where I can hop out of my ship occasionally and deal with fewer annoying “puzzles”.

I want to find ships in distress, pirate outposts among asteroid fields, scuttled ships I can scavenge, etc. In other words, space should be a mechanic, not just a setting.

The problem is that they let people skip the space parts arbitrarily often (sometimes planets make me stop to get scanned, sometimes I can go from ground to ground). All of those are encounters that happen, but if you fast travel you won’t see them. I have warped in and seen each of those, with ships in distress even landing near me to ask for help when I’m on the ground. Although the only actual pirate outpost in space AFAIK is the Crimson Fleet base and Everspace 2 does everything in space way better.

sugar_in_your_tea, (edited )

The fact that you can’t space walk without cheats is what I’m getting at. I want to be able to leave the ship to go investigate some wreckage, get into someone’s airlock to bring some needed supplies to a stranded vessel, or set up a mining outpost on an asteroid. Basically, the same feel you get when walking between towns in Elder Scrolls games, but with the unique mechanics space allows.

Starfield does a lot of things pretty well, but doesn’t really stand out in any of them. There’s a lot of elements of a great game there, but it just ends up being pretty good instead. That’s still awesome and it’ll sell well, but I am looking for that special something, and I’m basically seeing Skyrim in space. Not a lot of innovation, just a mapping of that formula into a space setting.

Honytawk,

Try joining the FreeStar Collective, which is Wild West Scifi just like Firefly.

You’ll get the same types of stories and encounters. Including distressed ships, pirate outposts among asteroid field and scuttled ships you can scavenge.

TBH, I haven’t missed any of the other mechanics you mention. Yeah would be cool to do a space walk, but is it really necessary?

sugar_in_your_tea,

It would be more immersive, just like flying into and out of planets with no loading screen would. Their Elder Scrolls games nailed that immersion, yet Starfield went backward with a bunch of loading screens and limitations.

It’s still a pretty good game, like an 8/10 or so, but to really get that GOTY 10/10 rating, they need to excel at something. Either have better immersion, or limit the scope in some way to improve other aspects of the game.

MotoAsh,

A good artist doesn’t do their art to please everyone, and knows that is a fool’s errand.

Stop projecting the failures of management on to the creatives.

jjjalljs,

Ehh I don’t know. We recently had both bg3 and elden ring. Both had near universal praise and no pay to win or micro transaction nonsense.

Kaldo,
@Kaldo@kbin.social avatar

Hi-Fi Rush, Remnant 2 as well in the AA area. It's been a pretty good year tbh

Silverseren,

Well made games get praised for being well made games and get the accolades and attention they deserve, at least on the AAA level.

If a AAA game isn't receiving that, then it's probably not a well made game.

Shiggles,

C is a passing grade. B is pretty decent. A implies you excelled.

I would say B is more than fair. It’s surprisingly not garbage for a bethesda title. It’s not the second coming of christ.

dangblingus,

There’s a lot of gamers out there who believe they are Bethesda fans, and this is one of the first times they’ve actually had to reconcile the game’s quality vs the developer they think consistently puts out good games. The amount of comments displaying obvious buyers remorse masquerading as defense of the game is hilarious.

BananaTrifleViolin,

I dunno, I think it's a game somewhat damned by faint praise. I hear "It's good, not great" a lot and I get it. If you like Skyrim you will like Starfield. But I'd say the big achievement is to scale up a game like Skyrim into such a big playspace.

It's certainly good quality in terms of the look and what they've technically achieved. But the actual gameplay isn't that far away from what they did in Skyrim and Fallout. I get it - if it ain't broke, don't fix it - but to be honest it feels a little dated. And No Man's Sky does alot of the non-RPG elements better.

It's been a strong year for games; and look at Baldur's Gate 3 - that game actually pushed forward narrative game play.

Starfield is huge and interesting, but ultimately a bit samey. I think the "ocean wide, inch deep" is too far and unfair but the basic concept kinda applies in a crude way. Baldur's Gate 3 is smaller in scope but so much richer and varied. Time was Bethesda was the undisputed king of RPGs, but I think CDProject Red supassed them with the story telling in Witcher 3 (and then fell back with Cyberpunk 2077) and now Larian have supassed both with Baldur's Gate 3.

It's a good game, but it's impact is dimmed a bit by what else has come. It'll make a ton of money and probably be around for years, but it doesn't feel the same huge leap forward as when Skyrim came out. But hey, hard act to follow to be fair.

PM_ME_FEET_PICS,

BG3 has very weak rpg and story telling elements.

Honytawk, (edited )

You have not played BG3 I see.

It is actually a Role Playing Game as in you get to decide what role (aka character) you want to play, unlike some of the other “RPGs” out there (looking at you Witcher).

PM_ME_FEET_PICS,

Played and 100% completed the game.

The Witcher series is a role-playing game. You are playing the role of the Witcher.

Your concept of what a role-playing game is very weak. From your idea of what a role playing game is I can call Battlefield 2042 a role-playing game.

hyperhopper,

There are so many actually good games out there, you need to branch out more if your bar for an A is that low

dangblingus,

You sound like you need to play more games. Gamers generally have every right to hate AAA games these days, as they are, categorically, not A grade games.

sugar_in_your_tea,

I guess that depends on how narrowly you define “genre.” It’s a pretty good sandbox RPG, and it’ll get even better with community mods. If that’s what you’re looking for, it’s great and way better than pretty much anything else.

But if you broaden it a bit, it has a mediocre story, mediocre combat, and mediocre exploration. So compared to other RPGs, it’s really not special.

So I’d give it a B grade. It gets Cs in many areas, but the sandbox is good enough to pull it up to a B. To get to A, it needs to excel at something, like exploration (e.g. do more with the ship in space) or economy (e.g. invest in trade routes and impact the cost of goods by flooding the market). But it doesn’t really excel at anything, it’s basically the same formula they’ve had in the past with a different setting.

It’s still a good game, it just doesn’t stand out in any particular way. For everything it does, another game does it better, and it really needs to be the best at something to get an A from me.

Kyoyeou, w I wonder why Godot and Unreal are getting so much interest today

Feels like I’m living the Pathfinder 2e boom again, I love it. Could they send the Pinkertons to the Cuphead studios next to perfectly do everything wrong

bionicjoey,

The nice thing about a company being run by evil people is that you can rely on them to eventually do something overtly evil, and then everyone will be aware they are evil.

falkerie71, w Splatoon 3: Expansion Pass - Side Order DLC | Nintendo Direct 9.14.2023
@falkerie71@sh.itjust.works avatar

Can’t wait! This looks amazing!

Thranduil, w Horizon Forbidden West Complete Edition is reportedly coming to PC

Now we just need permitted north to be made

brsrklf, w Innersloth (Among Us devs) post statement about new unity changes

Out of the loop. What’s the change?

From context it seems Unity is asking for a new fee per installed game, instead of using what the studio actually earned from the game?

If so, yeah, I get how it would be terrible if your game got a sudden huge install base from gamepass or such.

mordack550,

It will ask a small fee for every install, on top of the royalties. The issue seems that for small studios this fee is not feasible, and it seems that also pirated games and demos would count

Whirlybird,

It’s only once they’ve taken in like $200k in revenue btw. Demos don’t count, neither do game pass subscriptions or games bought via humble bundle etc.

Chozo,

They specified that demos MAY count. There's stipulations to that.

Whirlybird,

Only if the demo is the full game file.

Indicah,

$200k in revenue is pennies to a game developer of any size.

SulaymanF, (edited )

Also, trolls could delete and reinstall the app repeatedly, forcing the developer on the hook for large amounts of money to Epic games.

Whirlybird,

This has been confirmed not true. It’s on a machine level. You can install 10000 times on the same machine and it will only charge for 1 install.

Cqrd, (edited )

It was actually true that multiple installs per user would count multiple times, but Unity rolled back that decision not long after announcing it. However, install bombs will still be possible, I seriously doubt Unity has a fool proof way to accurately identify the same user over multiple installs if the user is reinstalling maliciously to cost the developer money.

flumph,
@flumph@programming.dev avatar

And? It would take a trivial amount of effort to spin up VMs and install the game on each. If I immediately tear the VM down after, I’m sure my cost would be covered by free AWS credits.

Whirlybird,

Why would anyone do this? Most games also don’t give you an unlimited amount of installs.

sugar_in_your_tea, (edited )

Trolls. Competitors. Vigilantes. This is the Internet.

flumph,
@flumph@programming.dev avatar

What? I’ve never played a game that limited the number of times I could install it.

Whirlybird,

On the number of machines you can install it on. Windows store games do this.

MurrayL,

Epic has nothing to do with Unity

Cheers,

But also, what entitles them to even a portion of the games proceeds? Adobe doesn’t get a cut for every digital piece you create. Dundermifflin doesn’t get a cut everytime you write a new contract. That’s absolute bullshit and they should get a fine for even thinking they’re allowed to be this big and change the rules like this. That’s a monopoly mindset.

brsrklf,

I guess it really depends how it’s done. I don’t think an actual cut of the proceeds is fair either, but stuff like having a low entry point and scaling your tool’s cost a bit according to the project success can be a good idea.

That said after they’d try to pull a stunt like they did I definitely wouldn’t trust them anymore.

dylanTheDeveloper, w Why Unity's New Install Fees Are Spurring Massive Backlash Among Game Developers - IGN
@dylanTheDeveloper@lemmy.world avatar

Suddenly there’s an 150% increase in Dev jobs using Unreal Engine 5

nanoUFO, w Creators of Slay the Spire will migrate their next game to a new engine if Unity doesn't completely revert their changes
@nanoUFO@sh.itjust.works avatar

It’s like crawling back to an abusive partner thinking things wont get worse.

AFaithfulNihilist, w Super Mario RPG | Nintendo Direct 9.14.2023
@AFaithfulNihilist@lemmy.world avatar

This came too late to pump up the demand for Geno to be brought into Smash, but I’m excited none the less.

Every part of the original game was top notch. Awesome characters that fit into an expansive world with lots of side quests and engaging combat. It game had awesome music too. And this looks like a real remake not just a port.

jdeath, w F-ZERO 99 - Nintendo Switch Online | Nintendo Direct 9.14.2023

what in tarnation…

ott, w Why Unity's New Install Fees Are Spurring Massive Backlash Among Game Developers - IGN

Can someone explain to me why they might have gone with this strange pricing model instead of the very simple revenue sharing model that Epic uses?

sugar_in_your_tea,

Something something $$$.

But yeah, revenue sharing makes a ton more sense. Maybe have a per-seat option up to $X in revenue, and a revenue percent above that amount.

EnglishMobster,

Because a lot of mobile games are made in Unity, and mobile has a higher rate of people who install and then uninstall without really playing the game. People also install things by mistake on mobile, thinking they’re something else.

So by charging based on installs, they’re able to squeeze developers a lot more (especially mobile game developers). Competitor engines like Unreal don’t run very well on mobile.

kadu, w Super Mario RPG | Nintendo Direct 9.14.2023
@kadu@lemmy.world avatar

I quite literally just started the SNES original, for the first time, 3 days ago… Guess I’ll stop and wait for the Switch release. The 2D graphics are surprisingly charming, but I bet the new version will have some QoL improvements.

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