I’m a big Dontnod fan. They really know how to craft an emotional story with some great character interaction and drama. None of their games is perfect, but they are always an enjoyable (and very emotional) ride.
This seems yet another LiS-game-but-different-title-for-legal-reasons (kind of like Tell me why), so I’m really looking forward to it.
Unless they’ve fired the absolute moron(s) who designed the crafting and alien language system in NMS, I say stay far away.
I mean, combining dihydrogen and oxygen yields… NaCl? And you learn alien words literally one at a time? Oh but they have procedural generation! Except every single space station looks identical.
IMO This is a developer who does not respect their players. And somehow they’ve convinced a lot of people that periodically adding more shallow grindy fetch quests means the core gameplay isn’t garbage.
I really wanted to like NMS. The core concept is 100% up my alley, it looks pretty good, and it’s a neat sandbox. I suppose it’s not bad if you’re the kind of player who is happy mindlessly gathering resources so you can craft an ornate base. Hell, I played quite a bit because I was determined to collect one of every type of spaceship.
But I really do think the gameplay is objectively bad by almost any possible measure. The on-foot traversal is terrible, waiting around for refiners sucks (though at least they had the sense to give a backpack refiner), trying to get the actual spaceship you want is awful, flying towards the galactic center is a chore, and I could go on. I guess the gunplay is serviceable, but the enemies aren’t the least bit interesting aside from maybe the largest walker bots.
I mean I don’t totally disagree with your statements, but how much playtime do you have in NMS? I have 85 hours and I am totally satisfied aka not thinking of returning regarding new patches with new “content”. Does that make it a bad game? I don’t think so. Is it the best spacesim ever, I don’t think so either. But it gets some features really nicely done:
like the feeling of and endless universe where you can travel wherever you want,
the exploration part where you are looking for your favourite planet ecosystem (it NEEDS dinosaurs!)
the crafting part, although I no clue how it changed to some years ago
starting and landing on planets (hi Shitfield)
But I agree the core gameplay loop is quite shallow, I see it more as a “light” sandbox game.
Yeah I like the “go anywhere” feel and was happy when I found a dinosaur planet too. But it still all feels 2 inches deep in so many ways.
I’ve come back to it a bunch of times because people keep insisting it’s good or “no you just need to try X” or “but the latest update added so much”. Steam says over 300 hours now but a decent portion of that was standing around trade hubs waiting for ships I wanted in S or A class, or literally just walking away from my PC while refiners ran.
I’m not usually the type of player to use cheats/exploits but I actually had more fun when I started using a duplication glitch. No more limited inventory, money, or resources, I could just pick one ship and one multitool and max them out with all the storage and weapons and whatnot. I don’t enjoy grinding so this was a relief. But it still didn’t make up for all the bad underlying mechanics.
This is the worst take I’ve seen in a LOOONG time. The language learning is one of the best systems in NMS. The developers literally spent YEARS adding to the game, completely for free, but they don’t “respect their players”?
I don’t know if you were around for the launch, but it was a pretty infamously bad because practically none of the promised features were present. Landing on asteroids, fighting space stations, significant factions, big space battles, sand/water planets, complex crafting, creatures affecting the environment, etc.
I think Hello Games has done a great job turning things around, and shown that they do respect their players, but the launch was definitely a disaster.
I know very well what was shown and what was stated, versus what was there at launch, but I’m interested in what you were going to cite. And I specifically asked about what was being referred to, because there’s a huge gap between the validity or veracity of many of the claims of lies.
Because if it’s just about the multiplayer working like anyone would obviously expect multiplayer to work, rather than just being able to see message boxes left by other people, yes, he lied to players about that, and he’s apologized many times for that, and talked about and shown the development pitfalls they ran into while they were trying to build the multiplayer, and has since implemented what was originally promised.
But I see people make other claims, almost always based on the original cinematic E3 trailer, which usually boil down to, “x feature that was present didn’t look like it did in a pre-rendered eye-candy trailer”, or things like “the flight system wasn’t 6DoF” which never even got mentioned, but was just assumed because spaceship, etc, and years later players still lie about what was or wasnt promised for a game that has since grown into having more content than was ever promised.
yes, he lied to players about that, and he’s apologized many times for that
And I’d like to see one of those apologies. With my surface level searches, I’ve found nothing.
Although I’m pretty sure there never was and never will be a direct apology, since that probably opens them up to litigation, but that’s just baseless speculation on my part.
What are you talking about? The player literally learns nothing about the alien languages. All you do is walk up to a NPC, button mash through absolutely inconsequential filler text, and pick the option that says “teach me a word”. Then a popup says “You now know the Korvax word for ‘THE’”, except it doesn’t even tell you which alien word was translated or explain any grammar or context or conjugation or anything. Your character just does a magical substitution from that point forward.
Or you can do the same thing by walking up to the black pillars if you’d rather trudge around a planet surface for macguffins.
How in any way is that a good system? There’s zero skill or challenge or reward or even real gameplay here. A word search puzzle would have 100x more depth.
Playing the game felt like satire. Basic questions I would expect other devs of sci-fi games to ask themselves seemingly either went unanswered or got super lazy answers.
e.g. “Should we let players customize their spaceships?” to which HG apparently thinks their system of solely generating ships from a random permutation of parts is plenty. Or “Do you think different planets and galaxies would have different hostile flora?”, to which they decided “nah, the same 3 are fine everywhere”. “Should planets have biomes of any kind, at least ice caps maybe?”… “nah, players don’t care if planets are basically uniform.”
They would have just abandoned the game if they didn’t respect the player base. I’m really interested why you have such a hate boner for hello games, I say this as someone who does not enjoy nms but respect that they kept trying to improve it over rhe years.
So many big game studios in the last 10 years (i.e. Activision, ea) have just shit all over the fans then wait a year and do it all over again. It’s really hard to hate a small dev team that at least is trying.
EA, Activision, Ubisoft… their BS is on another level entirely and I generally don’t play their games because if it.
For NMS / Hello Games it’s more that I really want to like the game but find it immensely frustrating that after years and years of updates, they still haven’t fixed some of the most basic elements.
Like when your character sprints, the tiniest bump in terrain cancels the sprinting. This even happens in the Nexus where it looks like flat ground. Why?
Again for the alien languages… there’s no dictionary in this universe? I’m supposed to believe interstellar travel is commonplace, but they don’t have an app to translate the 3 ubiquitous languages? I have a device in my hand right now that can do that.
Space combat still isn’t balanced. If you alternate between the phase beam with the shield absorb upgrade and any other weapon, you can basically wear down any threat and win.
What has actually been improved about the core game of NMS? People keep telling me that in vague terms without saying what specifically was improved. I know the inventory system is better (but still kind of a mess IMO), but what else? Don’t say multiplayer because they promised that at the beginning.
Fair enough on all of your points, it sounds like you’ve played more nms than I have. I do agree with you about the core game being somewhat flawed, I get bored very quickly trying to play it. I get the feeling this game just isn’t for people like us, but without a doubt they’re doing something right for their player base
You should probably read up in the redemption of Hello Games / NMS. They have released update after update, dlc after dlc, all for free. The game is truly completely different from what it was. Not many games has gotten this good of a follow up after it’s rough launch.
in the movies they only ever show 3 raptors on the island, 2 were killed by the trex at the end while the third was locked in the fridge by the kid. this is the teaser to say you will be hunted by a raptor in the game
How to show you haven’t kept up with NMS and the company at all since No Man’s Sky released.
There is little reason to believe this will be the same, they’ve given the players more than what was promised and continue to vastly expand NMS, all for free.
It seems that you need a refresher. I suggest you rewatch those original pre-release trailers and then try playing the game to see if it looks anything like that. I did that a few months ago, and spoiler alert, it did not. Continued support is of course praiseworthy, but it wouldn’t have been necessary if Hello Games had actually kept their promises to begin with. It boggles my mind that gamers so vehemently defend a company that took a decade longer than it should have to deliver some (not all!) of what was promised and also wasted a bunch of time and resources on bloating the game with stuff that was never mentioned and that nobody asked for. Gotta be some form of sunk cost fallacy or Stockholm syndrome or something…
Needless to say, I disagree with you that there’s little reason to believe this will be the same. On the contrary, there is every reason to believe that. Due to my skepticism, I was talked down to by people excited by the trailers back then, just like I’m being talked down to by you now. Vindication felt very sweet first time around, so I’m looking forward to round two.
That’s also something I was told in response to my skepticism during NMS’ pre-release hype phase, and it’s a complete misunderstanding of what’s going on here. I’m not trying to stop people from being happy, on the contrary, I’m trying to help them avoid disappointment by getting them to stop huffing hopium in industrial quantities. But they don’t wanna stop.
It’s not a “misunderstanding” when you’re laughing about what you think is going to happen and getting excited about your “vindication”. You’re not helping anyone here. You’re just trying to get them to join you in your cynicism.
It seems complaining about Cyberpunk has also become downvote-worthy these days. I think people are just all in on a good redemption arc so when a game is finally good they’re willing to overlook all the early promises that will never be fulfilled.
I would say it is justified given the amount of support they gave the game in the aftermath, all for free. I would instead encourage people not to buy games at launch. Also, it’s not like this new game is totally different either from NMS, you can clearly see the back bones from NMS. So it’s obviously that they’re going to use everything that is good from NMS in their new game.
The same people are at the helm, and they’ve managaed to make a massive profit by making up a bunch of stuff, releasing a broken, unfinished game and fixing it over the course of nearly a decade. What’s to say they’re going to do differently this time. If anything, they’re more likely to get a pass releasing a broken game now since it will probably eventually be what was promised at launch.
Edit: and I also want to highlight the fact that by supporting Hello Games (at least until we’ve seen definitive proof that this isn’t a repeat) we’re very directly showing support for the practice of releasing broken games.
Thats only true if it comes out broken, which hasn’t happened yet.
I’ll treat it the same as every other, if after a couple weeks once the hype has worn down the game actually fulfills the general schtick and seems to have learned and integrated its NMS lessons, then I’ll consider getting it.
I got NMS for ten bucks at the NEXT update and feel like I’ve gotten far more than my money’s worth. This title hasn’t proven anything yet, and I’ll wait for the truth before purchasing it like I do with every other game. It’s been this way since like 2013 when the industry started pumping out incomplete live service nonsense with seasons and battle passes.
I’ll treat it the same as every other, if after a couple weeks once the hype has worn down the game actually fulfills the general schtick and seems to have learned and integrated its NMS lessons, then I’ll consider getting it.
I got NMS for ten bucks at the NEXT update and feel like I’ve gotten far more than my money’s worth. This title hasn’t proven anything yet, and I’ll wait for the truth before purchasing it like I do with every other game. It’s been this way since like 2013 when the industry started pumping out incomplete live service nonsense with seasons and battle passes.
Thats exactly my point. We don’t know anything about the game, and are supporting it by just assuming that its going to be a great game and exactly whats promised from a studio that had previously lied frequently leading up to its last release. Thats why you don’t feed into another ridiculous hype train, and don’t pre-order or make day-one purchases. If they’ve actually learned their lesson and reformed, make them prove it before buying the game. I’m not saying don’t buy the game, I’m saying don’t buy in to the hype.
Oh for sure, definitely not going to hype it. I am going to follow it though and see what they show off.
I’m curious if they’ll be more open with their development process this time around, and if the company that has had issues in the past with four player connectivity can pull of server meshing.
Step 1: Release a shit game early that's nothing like its trailer and produce a shit ton of publicity through its consequential shit storm.
Step 2: Spent development time on it that you had originally planned for it anyway to fix things up a little bit, without ever reaching the state of the original trailer and get all the praise for being a shitty company because you've apparently done some magical redemption arc.
Step 3: ???
Step 4: Profit - and then do it all over again because people are gullible idiots.
You can apply the same shit to CP2077 and other games btw. At this point it is beneficial to just release a game in a shitty state because now you have the opportunity to use it as some PR mechanism of how great you are as a company for still caring for your games even after a shitty launch.
It really drives me crazy people defending the CP2077 debacle these days. Like I get it that it’s a fun game but that’s not what anyone is complaining about. We’re complaining about how it’s not and never will be the game they promoted in countless hours of previews in the months leading up to release.
Or simply the terrible the state it was in. Took them to 1.6 to finally fix the stupid framerate degradation, at least partially. And things like the story will obviously never be fixed.
Hi there Dark thoughts! I'm just curious as to why you've downvoted every single comment I've ever made on Kbin. Is this something you do to everyone who downvotes you one time? Seems a little extreme and immature don't ya think?
I do it with obvious lurker / alt accounts that are otherwise not active and apparently just exist to downvote other people. Legit accounts and especially those who could actually provide some valid counterpoints aren't receiving this treatment. This also includes a block, so consider this message a friendly courtesy of mine, but also the last thing you'll hear from me, as I have better things to do than argue with internet trolls. Have a nice vote manipulative day.
What the actual fuck? One downvote is all it took and this dude thinks I'm a troll. (Make that two, lol) If anyone else is reading this, I'm very real and this is my main account. Lol. Jesus Christ.
No, but the fact that the shots we see in the trailer already exists in NMS gives me hope that they can do what they claim this time (outside of Sean’s vague hints at server meshing allowing all people to be on the same earth) in terms of gameplay.
Networking code and their version of server meshing is the biggest wildcard here. But they have already proven they can make a procedural world with gameplay loops and multiplayer like the trailer. Nothing is out of the realm of possibility, and they have the entire NMS development/update experience to lean on now for making their second game.
But yeah, poach some SC devs to help you make the server meshing portion of it for sure.
I’m cautiously optimistic. I really hope this isn’t the first GTA game they ruin. I hate that they discarded the additions to GTA V’s single-player in exchange for GTA Online updates, I hope they won’t do that here, even though I did actually enjoy GTA Online too.
And that’s why this is a console only release for now.
That’s what doomed cyberpunk. I got my Series X halfway through the campaign, and it was a different game on the X vs the One. I wish they had scrapped current gen plans for that game and went next gen only. It would have been a more successful launch.
I won’t be pre-ordering (because they likely won’t be releasing on PC at launch, ugh), but I have high hopes. There hasn’t been a R* game without a killer story. I kinda expected RDR2’s story to be an afterthought to the online, as that was their first game since GTAOnline, however it was still an awesome single player campaign.
IMO almost every GTA has had derivative writing and set ups, but it’s okay because of everything else taking the spotlight. 3 was just Claude doing random missions until one mission lets you get revenge on Catalina and then the game just ends. Vice City is a revenge plot sort of but it’s just Tommy doing random jobs until Sonny’s like “oh you fancy huh?”. SA’s story was just batshit crazy all over the place. 4 IMO had the actual good story and didn’t seem derivative. Niko was a genuinely interesting character. V’s story was just straight forward “criminals finding out who snitched”, satisfying, but a bit scant. I just ask for a serviceable crime plot set in a vibrant and lived in world.
IV was the one I spent the most time on, so that makes sense. But with V it’s not a lack of depth, more a lack of continuity. Of course it’s been so long since I played it I can’t remember any specific examples, I just remember being disappointed, and thinking they spent so much time/money on the physics, they had nothing left for the story …
They didn’t yet, but they could at any time. Enshitification is a real thing and it’s starting to become more widespread. I just have to hope that GTA 6 will be good. I think it probably will be.
Overreaction much? GTA4 online granted didn’t even work, but V online is exactly how you want GTA online to behave, minus the load times. No one is forcing you to play online. You’ll easily get 100 hours just fucking around in single player.
I always thought I wanted GTA Online during the GTA3 era. Then when it became a reality, I realized I really didn’t want it and preferred the single player. The moment the story ends though, I have zero interest. Same with RDR2. Don’t care much to run around an empty world trying to collect 100% completion. Online is toxic and boring. Anything with an in game currency that you can buy with real money is a no from me. I guess I grew up in a different era when games were games and not gambling scams.
Well I guess this is where different Motivations for gaming come into play. I spent 800+ hours in GTA Online and most of that time was just spending time with my friends. Never spent a single Euro for Shark Cards.
It really isn’t. The idea started great, but they focused way too much on lobby play instead of missions. And lobbies were just not good, because of tech problems and because they just gave out overpowered stuff there you can’t counter. It all just felt too much, instead of your character just being a trailer gangster. And it’s very obvious that everything is focused on you having to buy shark cards. I enjoyed 3rd party clients way more.
NMS is my Zen game. I have over 500 hours in it just in the last two years. I know the game is not for everybody. I have friends who don’t understand why I hop through the galaxies, explore systems, hunt for ships, play the expeditions, and build base after base after base, even though so much can feel repetitive for some. But for me, it became my new Minecraft - “one more brick”. I love the expansive feel of it, and find the isolation relaxing. If i want to see others i can hop over to the Anomaly or hit the community build areas. I cannot wait to see what Hello Games has come up with.
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