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chicken, do gaming w Phil Spencer blames capitalism for games industry woes: 'I don't get [the] luxury of not having to run a profitable growing business'

you get a lot of publicly traded companies that are in the industry that have to show their investors growth—because why else does somebody own a share of someone’s stock if it’s not going to grow?

I thought the way it was supposed to work was, a company starts out investing in its growth and during this period shareholders get gains from the price of the stock going up, and then when it has maxed out just switch to shoveling the profits into dividends instead? If the industry has stopped growing, I don’t see why there isn’t a path to acknowledging that to investors, what am I missing?

Cowbee,
@Cowbee@lemmy.ml avatar

Growth is more valuable than dividends, and there’s always more room for growth in the eyes of investors.

chicken,

Growth is more valuable than dividends

Shouldn’t that depend on the dollar amounts? Why would $X of dividends be worse than $X of stock growth? And if growth just isn’t in the cards anymore, it would be in reality a worse bet as the companies pour resources into a black hole of false hope and self sabotage seeking something that isn’t actually going to happen.

Cowbee,
@Cowbee@lemmy.ml avatar

Growth stocks rise more because they carry more risk than steady dividend payouts. In a perfect dividend world, dividends would match growth, but because there is inherent risk in growth stocks there is a larger upswing

There are competing schools of thought in the investment world, and Growth has solidly beaten Dividend investing. Even better, going for a market-weighted global index fund is best.

PCurd,

You don’t pay tax on growth, you do on dividends. For large shareholders a high dividend can be a problem. Even for me, a very small time retail investor, I have to keep a balance of growth (like Apple) and dividend (I tend to use a dividend ETF so I can fairly reliably estimate my dividends) so I can avoid paying tax on the dividends.

chicken,

That makes a lot of sense. Seems like the way taxes are set up is creating perverse incentives here.

Juice88, do gaming w Phil Spencer blames capitalism for games industry woes: 'I don't get [the] luxury of not having to run a profitable growing business'
@Juice88@lemmy.world avatar

I can see why that would be a bummer. In my mind, the perfect video game-ceo position would be for a company that makes enough profit to pay its employees well and self sustains the business to keep making more games. Having to constantly report a higher user base and profitability growth year after year on a global scale would be a total drag.

ChuckEffingNorris,

Steam is a prime example of this. Not privately run it would have been bloated to extinction years ago.

Shareholders are leechers to quality. Dividends are not enough, the underlying asset must grow no matter what.

When Gabe croaks it Steam is fucked. It will go public.

kadu,
@kadu@lemmy.world avatar

Yeah, Gabe’s son is entirely focused on his own business, not related to gaming at all. Once Gabe is gone, his son will probably just sell it for an acceptable price and Steam will go public fairly soon after.

warm,

You dont think Gabe has surrounded himself with like-minded people?

He will pass it off to someone else and Valve will carry on as it has.

Duamerthrax,

So Valve if Valve still made games?

erwan,

That’s the thing, Valve is in this position because they have the Steam cash cow. Other video games company can’t do the same.

Duamerthrax,

I just want a real Half-Life squeal. Not a vr tech demo.

GoodbyeBlueMonday,

Alyx was incredible though! Way more than a tech demo (though I get the argument that it was a test to see if folks would pick up a VR Half-life 3). I played it on a cheap, used WMR headset and an old PC that could barely keep up, and it still stays in my top five videogaming experiences.

It’s a great example to bring up though, because I’d bet it wouldn’t have been made if the studio was only chasing money instead of trying to innovate.

Duamerthrax,

It was absolutely a tech demo. All Valve games were tech demos of one sort or another. The problem with that model is, if Valve doesn’t have some new tech to show off, there’s no Half-Life sequel. I actually predicted the we would only get another Half-Life game when Valve finally decided to get into VR about two years before they did. What I didn’t predict was that it would be VR Only or that it would be a prequel that reconned the timeline.

Valve has a fuck around with money that they could just let the devs make games on their own schedule, but instead Marc Laidlaw left the company and the fans have had to pick up the story lines and world. Honestly, Entropy Zero is a better game then Half-Life 2. Really take a moment to think about the weapons and combat in HL2. The maps weren’t designed with the enemy AI in mind, so many encounters just have you and them shooting at each other in empty rooms and hallways. So much focus was on the Gravity Gun, so all the other weapons save the Crossbow and Rocket Launcher were boring. Hell, why did they get rid of the mode switch on the Rocket Launcher? You have to take fire to your face if you want to hit anything with it.

TopRamenBinLaden, (edited )

Considering that Entropy Zero came out about 13 years after Half Life 2, I would hope it was better. It doesn’t really seem fair to compare the two. They were developed in different times, with different tech, and different games to draw inspiration from. That’s not to mention that Entropy Zero is a mod built on top of Half Life 2, and requires HL2s code to even run in the first place.

Duamerthrax,

Entropy Zero uses the same engine as HL2, which is why I used it as an example. I think HL1 is a better game then HL2 for the same reasons EZ is better then HL2. Better weapons and better enemy engagements. Whenever I do a franchise replay, the HL2 stuff is always a drag and I end up skipping the HL2 stuff eventually. Seriously, episode 2 has terrible driving in it. Other games had that figured out by then.

TopRamenBinLaden,

I see, I forgot it was a mod. Those are fair points for sure. I kind of like the pacing better in Half Life 1, myself.

warm,

MS still turned over $40 billion in profit last year. They just need to turn over more apparently this year. Fucking capitalism.

DragonTypeWyvern,

Do you have any idea at all how sus your username is?

Juice88,
@Juice88@lemmy.world avatar

Mine?

DragonTypeWyvern,

Yes, yours, bullshitter with two Nazi dogwhistles in your name and a new account.

Juice88,
@Juice88@lemmy.world avatar

Juice is a nickname I go by and I was born in 1988. Also yes, this is a new account, I started looking for a Reddit alternative when they started public trading last week. Where are the nazi symbols? I’m Mexican and Native American.

Finalsolo963,

88 = Heil Hitler

Juice->Jews

DragonTypeWyvern,

Even if it was innocent, putting 88 in your username at best makes you unoriginal and old.

You’re half dead and you still can’t figure out a unique name that doesn’t give Nazis cover?

Pathetic.

Juice88,
@Juice88@lemmy.world avatar

Well then I’m old and unoriginal Mr Dragon type. My screen name is what it is. I gave you an explanation that I didn’t owe you in the first place and this is all the effort that I’m willing to put in. Have fun being weirdly paranoid over usernames I guess.

DragonTypeWyvern,

Your words mean nothing even in your best case scenario.

Juice88,
@Juice88@lemmy.world avatar

That cool man. Look, I don’t do internet drama anymore (I’m old like you said). So I’m just going to block you now.

mnemonicmonkeys,

Dude, you really need to go touch some grass

DragonTypeWyvern,

🤡

HatchetHaro,
@HatchetHaro@lemmy.blahaj.zone avatar

step off the gas. nicknames and numbers can have entirely different cultural contexts.

for me, i’ve never seen “juice” used to refer to jews, nor “88” being used to refer to nazis, and i’ve been on the internet a long time.

when i see “juice”, the first thing i think of is the song by lizzo. “88” is used as a replacement for “bye bye” in cantonese lingo.

plenty of usernames are just random word + year of birth. stop overanalyzing it and chill.

DragonTypeWyvern,

🤡

vardogor,
@vardogor@mander.xyz avatar

what in the hell, lol. i think you’ve been on the Internet too much

my girl’s favorite number is 14, guess I gotta break the news to her that that means she’s a Nazi 😂

DragonTypeWyvern,

If her screen name is “Jews14” yeah, probably.

G*mers, lmao

vardogor,
@vardogor@mander.xyz avatar

juice is such a common nickname. but ig if you said so, they all nazis now. glad we have you policing forums n keeping us safe 🫡 ppreciate you

warm,

Guess I have to stop drinking juice!

TopRamenBinLaden,

You sound like the kind of person who would just assume Hindu temples were made by Nazis because they contained swastikas. Just because some assholes used a symbol as a dogwhistle doesn’t mean that the rest of the world should stop using it.

DragonTypeWyvern,

You sound like a gullible dumbass.

TopRamenBinLaden,

I’m not gullible, or a dumbass. Those are harsh words from somebody who can’t understand that not everything is a dogwhistle.

Your username is just as sus by your own logic. Grand Dragon is a title for leaders in the KKK.

DragonTypeWyvern,

-Says he isn’t a dumbass

-Immediately proved he is one, being a dumbass

TopRamenBinLaden,

Look, I definitely don’t hate you, and hate racists as much as anyone other upstanding citizen should. I honestly appreciate you looking out for them, and the username you called out could be seen as sus, for sure.

Just don’t let assholes steal the symbols for themselves, fuck them. Don’t disparage someone for not knowing about the dogwhistle and/or using a symbol non problematically. That was really my only gripe.

AceFuzzLord,

88 = Heil Hitler

That’s one I’ve never heard before. Is it some sort of neonazi slang or am I just really dumb?

Well, looked it up before posting this comment. That’s absolutely crazy that it’s an actual thing.

DragonTypeWyvern,

It’s literally one of their most common dogwhistles and has been for as long as the Internet has existed, lol

If you see a 14 or a 88 anywhere in a username you need to start asking questions about intent.

Finalsolo963,

I’m internet poisoned as hell but I’m surprised that that’s not common knowledge. Its also often 1488 with the 14 referring to the 14 words of the following neo-nazi slogans:

“We must secure the existence of our people and a future for white children”

“because the beauty of the White Aryan woman must not perish from the Earth.”

intensely_human,

So just don’t take your video game company public.

One thing Ayn Rand’s characters were definitely too selfish to do was allow a committee to take over their work.

Mon0, do games w 'The gold rush is over:' Slay the Spire and Darkest Dungeon devs say that big Game Pass and Epic exclusive deals have dried up for indie devs

deleted_by_author

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  • OneOrTheOtherDontAskMe,

    What is the gender crowd and how do I get their free cash you speak of?

    Mon0,

    deleted_by_author

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  • nednobbins,

    What’s the most prominent instance of a studio being forced to use Sweet Baby Inc.?

    EssentialCoffee,

    Can you link the solicitation or grant where people can apply for this?

    GeneralVincent,

    What a fascinating conspiracy theory. Interesting that you specify ngo, government agency, and government projects. Also interesting that you call it “woke/gender/diversity”. If you don’t mind me asking, where did you hear of this concept originally?

    Omega_Haxors, do gaming w You can't sue us for making games 'too entertaining,' say major game developers in response to addiction lawsuits

    That argument doesn’t fly for companies that employ psychologists specifically to make their games as unhealthy as possible.

    dan1101, do gaming w Phil Spencer blames capitalism for games industry woes: 'I don't get [the] luxury of not having to run a profitable growing business'

    You can grow without being hostile and negative. Start your own studios, make innovative games, compete with quality not acquisitions.

    hexadence,
    @hexadence@lemmy.world avatar

    the best and the only answer. git gud. 💪

    digdilem,

    Not everybody is suited to management.

    whereisk,

    Yes, but can you roll a platform of the distribution, breadth, depth and persistence over good and bad cycles of the scale of Xbox or PlayStation while being a private company? A few have tried.

    BorgDrone,

    No, but do you have to? You can still be a profitable company without aiming for world domination.

    whereisk,

    No, there are plenty of independent private game developers (Stardew Valley, Baldur’s gate etc come to mind) I was just taking Phil Spencer’s perspective, which I imagine is a platform level one.

    hexadence, do gaming w So, looks like Putin's ordered the Russian government to 'consider the issue of organising' domestic versions of the Steam Deck, SteamOS, and Steam itself (with a side order of Steam Machines)
    @hexadence@lemmy.world avatar

    Sounds ambitious. Games are an important part of modern culture. Recognizing that is a responsible action. On the other hand, haters will have more than just Epic Games to be angry at, so it is a win for everyone.

    Pyr_Pressure, do gaming w You can't sue us for making games 'too entertaining,' say major game developers in response to addiction lawsuits

    There’s a difference between addictive and entertaining.

    I wouldn’t call nicotine entertaining.

    Opening lootboxes you paid $5 each for is not entertaining.

    Red_October, do gaming w You can't sue us for making games 'too entertaining,' say major game developers in response to addiction lawsuits

    Well, you can sue someone for anything, you just can’t win for anything. For instance, those developers could countersue because the negligence and bad parenting of those parents materially damaged the reputation of those companies.

    intensely_human, do gaming w Phil Spencer blames capitalism for games industry woes: 'I don't get [the] luxury of not having to run a profitable growing business'

    Oh yeah I’m sure the lack of a profit motive would just make games amazing 🙄

    kudos,

    Profit isn’t the issue, it’s having to continually show outsized profit growth rates to keep shareholders happy that’s the problem. Look at private companies like Valve for comparison.

    intensely_human,

    Exactly

    Jomega,

    Great art was never created for its own sake /s.

    intensely_human,

    And people never spend money on things based on how good they are /s

    Jomega,

    Things are often better when the people making them give a shit.

    thesporkeffect,

    Do you exclusively play sports game [current year]?

    intensely_human,

    Nope. Thank god there’s a free market and therefore I have options.

    Crikeste, do gaming w Phil Spencer blames capitalism for games industry woes: 'I don't get [the] luxury of not having to run a profitable growing business'

    Phil Spencer, you have the luxury to quit if you don’t like the things you’re being forced to do for money.

    Or, you could use your influence to try and push things in a different direction.

    But Phil Spencer, you will do neither. You’ll shut up and keep dribbling.

    Silentiea,

    Seriously. Everyone gets the luxury of not having to run a profitable growing business. You didn’t “have” to run that business at all.

    Silentiea,

    And I get that the business maybe “has” to be run that way, because of the way it exists in the economic system it exists in, but I’m definitely taking issue with the language he’s employed here. He’s not a prisoner being forced to run things this way.

    VinesNFluff, do gaming w So, looks like Putin's ordered the Russian government to 'consider the issue of organising' domestic versions of the Steam Deck, SteamOS, and Steam itself (with a side order of Steam Machines)
    @VinesNFluff@pawb.social avatar

    Dendy Deck.

    aluminium, do gaming w So, looks like Putin's ordered the Russian government to 'consider the issue of organising' domestic versions of the Steam Deck, SteamOS, and Steam itself (with a side order of Steam Machines)

    Go to Sjewjerodonezk to claim a free deck

    Dumbkid, do gaming w Phil Spencer blames capitalism for games industry woes: 'I don't get [the] luxury of not having to run a profitable growing business'
    @Dumbkid@lemmy.dbzer0.com avatar

    I think the real problem is businesses have to grow. If most big companies weren’t publicly traded then just being profitable would be enough.

    Imagine making enough money to pay you and everyone else in your company a great wage one year, but it being bad because it wasn’t more profit than last year.

    Anticorp,

    I’ve seen companies phrase 8% growth as a negative because they missed their 10% growth target that they just pulled out of their own ass.

    kadu,
    @kadu@lemmy.world avatar

    Infinite growth in an obviously finite world is such a moronic concept, yet the driving force of capitalism

    ghostblackout, do gaming w So, looks like Putin's ordered the Russian government to 'consider the issue of organising' domestic versions of the Steam Deck, SteamOS, and Steam itself (with a side order of Steam Machines)

    I think there doing it because they think there a weapon because Ukraine is using them for their weapon systems

    hesusingthespiritbomb, do gaming w Phil Spencer blames capitalism for games industry woes: 'I don't get [the] luxury of not having to run a profitable growing business'

    I get the feeling the part of capitalism Phil Spencer hates is the part where consumers can take their business elsewhere if they don’t like the product.

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