videogameschronicle.com

simple, do games w ‘We tried and it didn’t work out’: CDPR co-founder says it shouldn’t stray from AAA open-world RPGs

The co-founder is definitely referring to the Gwent standalone game. I played it when open beta came out but it steadily went downhill from there until they eventually stopped working on it in 2023.

Deflated0ne,
@Deflated0ne@lemmy.world avatar

By the time I wanted to play that it was gone.

RollForInitiative,

They also created a standalone, story based Gwent card game that is pretty good, just in case you didn’t know: Thronebreaker: The Witcher Tales

unconsciousvoidling,

This is an excellent game and a good soundtrack.

Jyrdano,

I liked that game. Then they decided to completely rework it. IMO for the worse. It went downhill from there.

simple,

Yeah I’m still not sure where they were going with reducing it to two lanes instead of 3.

acosmichippo,
@acosmichippo@lemmy.world avatar

i wanted gwent on my phone, not on my PC. i forgot about it by the time it released for phones.

p03locke,
@p03locke@lemmy.dbzer0.com avatar

It was still a really good game by the time they stopped working on it, and one of the least greedy CCG I’ve ever seen. Hearthstone was already starting to lose players, and they had a shot at being a replacement, even if the mechanics of the game were rather different.

And then Marvel Rivals came out and the CCG landscape was just overpopulated.

simple,

I think you mean Marvel Snap, but yes. Even the biggest pvp card games are struggling to retain players.

osprior, do games w MultiVersus officially closes down and is delisted today

If you aren’t already aware of it (and in the EU) please sign the stopkillinggames.com petition so companies can’t just drop “support” (that these days means kill) games when they feel like it.

wondrous_strange,

What are you suggesting? That on once a game goes online it’ll require the company by law to keep it running forever? How many companies would still release games that requires backend if they knew it’s a never ending endeavour even if they’ll lose money from it?

Running the infrastructure to host the game’s baceknd requires money, and releasing the server code as binary or open source is not something that’ll happen.

So what is the end goal?

secret300,

Required games and games studios to build the game to be played offline or have the ability to self host the server.

DarkMetatron,

The companies could shut down their servers, if they at the same time would release the software needed to run the servers. This would allow the creation of community servers, without any costs or responsibilities for the companies

There was a time when multiplayer games all came with dedicated server binaries.

ArchmageAzor,
@ArchmageAzor@lemmy.world avatar

It would require devs to start planning for indefinite support during development. Wether that means releasing server software and the source code or not making the game reliant on servers in the first place is up to them.

Tattorack,
@Tattorack@lemmy.world avatar

Oh for fuck sake, this has never been a good argument, and people who keep repeating these argument-questions (almost like they’re a copy paste) either never read what Stop Killing Games demands, or lack the reading comprehension necessary to understand it.

The third option would be malicious sabotage, but I’m hoping it’s just one of the two stupidity options.

SaharaMaleikuhm,

It is kinda crazy how these always pop up immediately.

M0oP0o,
@M0oP0o@mander.xyz avatar

Yeah I could not comment so quick unless I programmed something to do it for me…

Johnmannesca,
@Johnmannesca@lemmy.world avatar

Better service for the community. Take a look over towards Spellbreak for a second and you’ll see a community that has taken what Proletariat had given them after an acquisition by Blizzard and started doing private servers to keep their game functional. I think there’s much to learn from this End-of-Service model, perhaps we could have more privately hosted servers to reduce their overhead if companies truly loved their fanbase; might even be feasible to follow that model from the start for f2p games so the official servers are more capable for tourneys and the like. Either way the goal is end user satisfaction, so if those means are preservation or archival like with Yu-Gi-Oh! Cross Duel, then so be it the fanbase does what they want ultimately, but we just ask companies to offer their olive branch so that all their precious arts don’t drown in the ever expanding sea of data.

wondrous_strange,

Am not a gamer, and am not informed about your little battle. So i asked a quesion, not made an argument. From the responses to my questions it is obvious how spoiled and toxic your community is. Good luck 🩷

SaharaMaleikuhm,

Just click the link and inform yourself. Could have answered the question yourself within minutes.
It’s clear you do not actually want answers at all. I hate your pretentious attitude.

wondrous_strange,

I clicked, and saw an incoherent wall of text. It is not that important for me to understand what you’re whining about, and you fail to deliver your point in a manner which will result in any sympathy.

You are treating silliy video games as if it’s a matter of life and death. Why would anybody take you seriously? You make ot so easy for them to milk you for money. I suggest grow up.

Dremor,
@Dremor@lemmy.world avatar

“Oh no, it isn’t a 20s TikTok video!1! How could anyone understand such gibberish neatly organized text with detailed explaination of why preserving games is important!11!1”

But seriously, you are on a community about games, define yourself as not being a gamer, and clearly show you have no idea of the topic at hand, why do you even bother engaging in this conversation?
Just leave us, silly gamers, try to protect the medium we share and love, and continue on your way.
I doubt anything here is of any worth to you.

wondrous_strange,

This is a public forum, and you are acting like spoiled children. I’ll comment as I please.

Take all that superior knowledge you have about infrastructure and engineering and build your own games that conforms to your world view instead of gaming all day while complaining and consuming colorful energy drinks.

If it was important to you as you claim, you wouldn’t have supported the game publishers from the get go, but you do. It is just easier and funner to shit post instead of doing anything productive, right?

Have fun in your little echo chamber of pathetic nonsense, no one will take you seriously.

JAWNEHBOY,

FAQ page has your exact question answered - saved you one click from the link above. Clearly a lot of effort has been put into the site because online spaces we’ve enjoyed can’t be enjoyed any further even if we were interested in maintaining them ourselves as volunteers.

wondrous_strange,

Its like the 6th on the lost or something. Clearly a lot of thought.

Running the infrastructure today is not the same as it was back when unreal was first released, for many many reasons.

iegod,

Gamers are by and large toxic and ignorant. The ask isn’t as straightforward as they make it seem. It would require changes to the binaries and client code beforehand. This doesn’t come for free. All the examples of ‘how it used to work in the past’ are predicated on the specific choices of development to go that route. If an application and server are not architected that way then releasing the server binaries do nothing for the community.

wondrous_strange,

Yeah exactly but I don’t think anyone here is capable of comprehending that.

Dremor,
@Dremor@lemmy.world avatar

I’d agree for an MMO, which can be quite complex server-wise. But most “online single player” would be quite easy to modify.

I’m a software developer who worked with asynchronous online systems.
A simple disk caching system could replace any uploaded data, and any online call can be written to work with cached data with a few line of code. Heck, on some frameworks you could write a simple middleware to make it work without changing a line of the original code.
I could do it on such game in less than a week on a language I don’t know, and probably a day or two on one I know about.

qarbone,

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  • wondrous_strange,

    deleted_by_moderator

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  • ampersandrew,
    @ampersandrew@lemmy.world avatar

    Releasing the server code as binary is how it used to work, and there’s no reason it can’t work that way again. It’s one of several ways to satisfy the petition.

    madjo,

    You know you can still play Unreal Tournament online against other people? That game came out in 1999!

    The problem you sketch has been solved already.

    All it takes is for the game developer to release the server binaries. And for fans of the game to run servers.

    JustARegularNerd,

    From the FAQ of stopkillinggames.com website

    Q. Aren’t you asking companies to support games forever? Isn’t that unrealistic?

    A: No, we are not asking that at all. We are in favor of publishers ending support for a game whenever they choose. What we are asking for is that they implement an end-of-life plan to modify or patch the game so that it can run on customer systems with no further support from the company being necessary. We agree that it is unrealistic to expect companies to support games indefinitely and do not advocate for that in any way.

    tomi000,

    Interesting how strongly you are opposing an idea that noone proposed, which you would have known had you taken a look at the petition.

    wondrous_strange,

    deleted_by_moderator

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  • Dremor,
    @Dremor@lemmy.world avatar

    As you are not a gamer, I’ll try to make it simple.

    If a game ask for an online connection, is usually for three reasons:

    • multiplayer, or some kind of social interaction
    • drm, to make it harder to cheat, or redistribute cracked versions of said game
    • telemetry, either to know how players plays their game, or to sell you as an ad target

    When the publisher decide to stop the online component, to save a buck, it often mean the game stops working altogether because of the DRM part, as it basically refuses to start without the proper authorization from the now defunct server.

    The petition do not ask them to keep running the server indefinitely, but rather to

    • make it possible to bypass the DRM always online part to be able to play the single player part, if there is one. In most case, it is a simple change to do, a function to modify in order to always return “true” (game can be played)
    • allow the end user to self host the server. It doesn’t mean open-sourcing it, just to release the server software and allow to point to another server than the defunct ones

    In both case, the code already exist, and the changes required are minimal, so why not do it? It costs barely anything to the devs/publisher, and gives the game a second life, even without official support.

    But they don’t. Mostly out of greed, to push people to buy the newest, micro-transaction infused game they wish to sell, sometimes even the same game with half the content replaced by micro-transaction (Overwatch 2 being the perfect example).
    They don’t want an older, maybe better game to overshadow their new shiny cash grab.

    wondrous_strange,

    I agree with most of what you said,.

    On the other hand -

    1. If you don’t like their approach, stop buying their games.
    2. Servers today are much more complex than what they were 25 years ago, and making them in such a way to any idiot could run on their laptop requires substantial effort. I can see how it might not be financially feasible for every company to do. Relaaing the server software will introduce a whole new category of issues that the company will need to face. Shipping a stack of 20 independent services that are orchestrated together is not a single binary, and is not meant to run on any platform.
    Dremor,
    @Dremor@lemmy.world avatar
    1. Well, I don’t. It doesn’t void my freedom to express my opinion on the matter.
    2. I also maintain server (my own, sometime other people server when asked to), and even worked with an open sourced MMO server (Ryzom). Those don’t need to be hard to maintain, except if the architect is a idiot that followed the tend of “microservices”, which does’t make much sense for an MMO.

    If they aren’t good enough to make software that makes sense, we’ll find a way to make them work. Don’t underestimate a band of hyperfocussed nerd.
    Some guy already programmed a whole unofficial MMO server from scratch, which ended up to be even better than the official one. Unfortunately is wasn’t ever released for obvious copyright infringement reasons, but still.

    wondrous_strange,

    1.indeed you do. Still it is advised to think before speaking. 2.I said nothing about “micro”. It sounds like you have great expertise in this area and clearly know how it all works so kudos you won 🥳

    You won’t be able to do none of that, cause none of it is yours. If anything, I feel like I’m overestimating you just by having this discussion. Not clear to me why you feel so entitled to the products of others. You are a gamer, it is barly a hobby.

    Dremor,
    @Dremor@lemmy.world avatar

    On that our opinion differs.

    Games, like movie, are a way to make art. It allows ways of expression that other medias cannot.

    Of course not all games are made with the artistic value in mind, like not all movies are, but those are nontheless pieces of our collective culture, be it something like a racing game, or a little platformer.
    All thoses are the result of hundred, if not thousands of hours of work, from programmers, to musician, with all others support tasks in between.

    For a movie, imagine if you had to constantly be connected to a server, and that suddenly, for nobother reason than saving a buck for the company owning the movie, no one could watch it anymore. Countless masterpieces would be lost to time, not because the original band was lost in a fire like many did through time, but because of someone greed and refusal to make them readable without that punny server.

    That petition ask just that same treatment for video games, nothing more. We are not asking for remaster, nor a continued support on new consoles, just a way to preserve the shared memories we hold dear.
    Memories of friends who played with us, friends that may not be of this world anymore. Memories of stories told and lived.
    To not forget what was, what could have been, and what can be.

    MajesticElevator,

    It will never work

    Elevator7009,

    Even if it doesn’t work, I’d at least want to let people try and get practice doing something about a problem (even if that’s just leaving a comment on social media to direct others to sign a petition that will eventually get lawmakers’ attention with enough signatures based on that country’s laws, because that still has more chance for good than yet another comment about X Thing Bad. Even though I agree with a lot of Lemmy’s X Thing Bad takes), makes them more likely to do something in the future. At least they can walk away saying “I tried”. Some people might see no guarantee of results for their time and think of it as time wasted, and that is their choice, but I don’t really see a reason to say “that’ll never work” without any offer of alternative. Most charitably, you are trying to save them time and disappointment, trying to prevent a “it didn’t work, activism does not work, I’ll never do anything like that again” attitude if it fails, but I think a lot of people are just seeing the comment as pointless negativity.

    XiberKernel,

    It worked for USB C? And y’all have alternate app stores over there too. I don’t believe it’s unrealistic to guarantee that a product you sell will remain functional after support ends.

    MajesticElevator,

    Eh, we’ll see. USB C and other app stores made Apple gain less money, whereas this petition would make it cost more to implement such a thing, and could be a sizeable problem for specific games which heavily relies on proprietary algorithms or just the game itself, such as mmorpg, small companies…

    WhiteBurrito,

    It’s honestly very little work to implement a way for a game to be offline… Basically just remove the method that checks for a server and that’s it…

    What could be a bit more costly would be releasing server implementations so people can host their own game servers, but it should still be expected… Actually it wouldn’t be that hard IF it’s taking into account from the get go coz you can just release the last release before being shut down and that’s it

    MajesticElevator,

    An online-only game without server requirement… isn’t a game anymore

    And yea, if the law only applies in a couple of years, then all good since devs can take that in mind, which makes it a lot easier

    WhiteBurrito,

    It is if there’s ways to shift the server connection to a community hosted server…

    Phegan,

    Not with that attitude.

    Emil_Zatopek1982, do games w ‘We tried and it didn’t work out’: CDPR co-founder says it shouldn’t stray from AAA open-world RPGs

    CDPR’s open worlds are cardboard props to the stories.

    zaphod,

    They are in almost all open world games.

    Leg,
    @Leg@sh.itjust.works avatar

    Yeah, I see open world games as fancier tabletop games in most cases. Which isn’t a bad thing by any means.

    BuboScandiacus,
    @BuboScandiacus@mander.xyz avatar

    The cyberpunk one was great, because it was so beautiful that merely driving in it was enjoyable

    TW3’s open world was boring and terrible in every way

    Wahots,
    @Wahots@pawb.social avatar

    The DLC had good open worlds, but the main game just felt too dreary and brown.

    markovs_gun,

    I’m just curious what you think is a good open world then

    ILikeBoobies, do games w Cyberpunk 2 is now in preproduction, CD Projekt says

    At least everyone knows not to trust this dev anymore and won’t buy the game until it’s actually finished

    Sad this likely means the first one never gets finished

    secret300,

    Yeah their greed is disgusting. I wander how many DLCs they’ll make for this next one before it’s finished

    Phoenicianpirate,

    Expansion packs have existed since the 90s at least. There were also special editions and stuff before DLCs were possible.

    secret300,

    Umm okay? Cool fact bud

    Phoenicianpirate,

    Just saying if they do release DLCs and add ons it isn’t something particularly new or particularly greedy.

    secret300,

    It is greedy when they ask for more money for “extra” content for an unfinished game.

    Whateley,

    What are you even talking about? They only shit you had to pay extra for was Phantom Liberty. Every other update or content release has been free.

    secret300,

    And it was greedy as hell because when that DLC was announced and released the game was still buggy and unfinished. The game still doesn’t feel complete without the DLC is what I hear from everyone I know and multiple reviews

    _cryptagion,

    The game is not only finished and complete, but Phantom Liberty was the best damn DLC I’ve ever played for any game in any genre, since the Shivering Isles for Oblivion.

    PraiseTheSoup,

    What a blisteringly stupid thing to say, considering art is subjective.

    _cryptagion,

    Phantom Liberty was the best damn DLC ---- I’ve ---- ever played

    Yes, dumbass, which is why I said it’s the best for me, subjectively. Don’t fucking reply if you’re too stupid to read what I write.

    PraiseTheSoup,

    I love how you’ve personally taken offense to everyone shitting on your precious cyberpunk in this thread. It was broken trash in 2020 and it’s only slightly less trash in 2025 bud. Sorry you have poor taste.

    _cryptagion,

    What I take offense to is incel neckbeards coming into a thread and shitting on everyone who likes something they don’t.

    PraiseTheSoup,

    incel neckbeards

    What a blisteringly stupid thing to say, considering I’m a woman.

    _cryptagion,

    Oh, sorry for misgendering you then. I meant to say femcel neckbeard.

    secret300,

    Damn I’m sorry. I didn’t know people had such little exposure to good content

    _cryptagion,

    Art is subjective. You don’t get to speak for anyone but yourself. Half the world thinks what you like is shit, but go on about how you know what’s really good.

    secret300,

    I know greed when I see it. I know cut content when I see it. A good DLC doesn’t include stuff that should’ve been in the game.

    CDPR did good with the witcher series years ago. But after cyberpunk they showed how disgusting they can be. They don’t deserve money. Have fun and enjoy the game but don’t defend it, there’s no point

    _cryptagion,

    I’ll defend it if I want. Neither you nor anyone else gets to decide anything for me, so fuck out of here with that attitude. There’s a reason you and the people who share your opinion are getting downvoted so much in this thread. That reason is people think your opinion is shit.

    secret300,

    That’s a wild to me that you’d defend blatant greed, but to each their own I guess.

    _cryptagion,

    Nobody here has done that, and that’s such a piss-poor attempt at a straw man that you frankly should be ashamed of even trying it.

    secret300,

    You literally are…? I’m shitting on CDPR for their greed and you’re saying it’s your choice to support them.

    _cryptagion,

    Just a note, saying “literally” does not, in fact, make something true. Nor am I responsible for your inability to comprehend what you read.

    secret300,

    This is you LITERALLY saying I’ll defend it…

    https://lemmy.sdf.org/pictrs/image/b10cf275-f012-431a-a229-9e56afb41bff.png

    _cryptagion,

    That is me literally saying I’ll defend the game. It’s your words that defending the game is defending “greed”, which is a bullshit, weak ass argument.

    Whateley,

    You don’t need PL to get the latest patches and updates.

    “From what I hear from everyone I know”

    My brother in Christ, have you even played the game?

    secret300,

    I never said that I said the game doesn’t feel complete without it

    _cryptagion,

    The first one was finished, and is a fantastic game.

    szczuroarturo,

    Yeach . It had rocky start but damm disregarding bugs the praises were more than deserved. Literally the best action RPG that exists.

    PraiseTheSoup,

    Literally the best action RPG that exists.

    Spoken like someone that has played about four or five video games in their entire life. It’s not even an RPG. It’s a shitty first person shooter with pointless skill trees tacked on. Even if you were to classify it as an action RPG, it doesn’t crack the top 20.

    _cryptagion,

    What a blisteringly stupid thing to say, considering art is subjective.

    szczuroarturo,

    It absolutley does. Also cyberpunk actually gives you a lot of freedom on how you aproach combat. Can you play it as mindless shooter. Yup . But you can also play deus ex like that and no one calls it a shitty first person shooter ( even tho thats technicaly the easiest way to finish the game ). And as far as the world and story is concerned its equisite. As far as whetewer its an RPG or not. If mass effect is an RPG than so is cyberpunk i think . Very subjective thing in general . Definietly not a hill im willing to die on.

    _cryptagion,

    It’s absolutely a fantastic game. I’m glad Gibson is giving his blessing for the sequel, I’m looking forward to it!

    Jimmycakes,

    A rocky start? It got removed from the game stores and full refunds given. That’s not a simple “rocky start” the released a pre alpha at full price.

    ILikeBoobies,

    Not feature complete to pre-release promises/expectations

    You don’t have to lie to justify your purchase, you can enjoy it for what it is

    _cryptagion,

    The game is finished. Maybe not finished to your expectations, but it is definitely finished, and is a damn fine action RPG. And Phantom Liberty is the best damn DLC for any game I’ve ever played since the Shivering Isles for Oblivion.

    Calling others opinions lies just because you don’t appreciate what they’re saying is what we in the industry like to call a “bitch ass move”.

    ILikeBoobies,

    Reconsider what you responded to and what finished means

    _cryptagion,

    I don’t need to reconsider shit, the game is finished, and is amazing.

    thermal_shock,

    It was pretty damn solid. I didn’t finish it, I had fun running around blasting gang members. Ducking through alley ways was the shit.

    Redredme,

    It was finished and buggy… it’s now finished, fixed and expanded.

    _cryptagion,

    If it’s good enough for Gibson, it’s good enough for me.

    A_Random_Idiot,

    Right now is where it should have been on release.

    A_Random_Idiot,

    CP2077 was not finished when it came out at the end of 2020.

    This revisionist history of it being complete on release will get no traction here.

    _cryptagion, (edited )

    Literally nobody said that. Your username checks out.

    Deflated0ne,
    @Deflated0ne@lemmy.world avatar

    Speak for yourself choom. I’ll buy that scop on launch day. (I only preorder RGG games cuz they have never missed)

    Vanilla_PuddinFudge,
    @Vanilla_PuddinFudge@infosec.pub avatar

    lol, buy?

    ampersandrew, do games w ‘We tried and it didn’t work out’: CDPR co-founder says it shouldn’t stray from AAA open-world RPGs
    @ampersandrew@lemmy.world avatar

    Well, The Witcher 1 and 2 weren’t open world, and those turned out pretty well, especially 2. There’s something to be said about what a game from them might gain by doing more in a smaller world.

    Rusty,

    I tried playing Witcher 2 when it came out, but couldn’t. It’s so immersion breaking when some parts of the map are blocked by some gates or invisible walls. When Witcher 3 came out I was hesitant at first remembering my bad experience with 2, but I loved it so much.

    ampersandrew,
    @ampersandrew@lemmy.world avatar

    How did you feel about Baldur’s Gate 3? Because the structure of the maps in the first two Witcher games are what most of the genre is like.

    missingno, do games w MultiVersus officially closes down and is delisted today
    @missingno@fedia.io avatar

    They're patching it to be playable offline, but only if you've previously downloaded the game.

    Why not just leave that version up instead of delisting it? They could even sell it. Would be seen as a success story for preservation instead of another loss, and it's especially baffling because it's a fully avoidable loss.

    fluxion,

    According to the bean counters this will save them $17/month in hosting costs

    golli,

    Do you even have to pay hosting costs, if you put a game on steam or does valve not distribute your game for free?

    If I’d have to guess the bigger issues with a game like this would be licensing or that delisting allows some form of tax advantageous asset depreciation.

    pipe01,

    You don’t pay anything to steam other than the initial 100 bucks or so, and the cut they take

    Sylvartas,

    Valve hosts it for “free” (30 to 15% of every sale), yes.

    I’m guessing this game has some phone-home DRM or something, and maybe it’s only required the first time it’s executed after installation ? They could of course just give the game a patch that removes it but I guess they don’t want to anger the line investors and make it go down by working even a second on a “discontinued” game.

    Goretantath,

    Pretty sure hosting costa arent it, the only thing possible woyld be licensing issues for the IP’s otherwsie they could leave it on steam forever and STILL make money off of sales. There are games that do this by making the players host their own servers each match.

    MrScottyTay,

    But they own the IPs…

    CaptPretentious,

    I would venture to guess it’s to avoid potential licensing issues that could arise down the road that they don’t want to deal with.

    spankmonkey,
    @spankmonkey@lemmy.world avatar

    Were any characters in the game not owned by Warner Bros?

    CaptPretentious,

    Potentially, I don’t exactly know all the rights owners.

    But just looking at the roster, I’d assume Arya Stark might be the most complicated. While HBO falls under WB, unsure if ol’ George signed away all rights to the character. And there’s always future deals too, since rights holders can change hands.

    Tattorack,
    @Tattorack@lemmy.world avatar

    Yeah, they’ve just ensured the only way a person can play it is through piracy. Very smart move, WB, very smart…

    Goretantath, do games w MultiVersus officially closes down and is delisted today

    The reason that games are even hosted on “official” servers like these is to ensure the company can take the game down once the devs run out of time o the contract they made for all the IP’s they use in said game. Otherwise its possible AND has been done before to let the players machines spin up a server each match.

    Goretantath,

    The only issue was having to have a “matchmaking” server but even then, steam has the tools to replace that entirely.

    Kolanaki,
    @Kolanaki@pawb.social avatar

    That could be one reason, at least in a game such as MultiVersus with different IPs being used.

    But they still lock down servers to their own shit when they own it all anyway and it’s because they also sell you crap to have in the game. If you had your own server, you could just give yourself the stuff they sell since all those things are still in the game somewhere and the only barrier between you and the content is their servers checking to see if you paid for them.

    epicsninja, do games w MultiVersus officially closes down and is delisted today

    This game leaves behind a legacy of extremely funny poor decisions and mistakes, culminating in becoming one of the few games that got to be shut down twice.

    VitoRobles,

    The worst part, the demo was actually pretty good.

    They literally could have released this game with mod support, and sold it for $20 and it would have been a fun party game.

    Instead, they kept going on with BS games as a service.

    epicsninja,

    Games as a Service wasn’t even the fatal flaw here. Brawlhalla is another platform fighter that is doing just fine off that model. The dev team for MultiVersus just couldn’t handle the project, for one reason or another.

    A lot of speculation on the specifics of what went wrong, plenty of players looking for who to blame, but there will probably never be any reliable or concrete info on what exactly happened.

    VivianRixia, do games w MultiVersus officially closes down and is delisted today
    @VivianRixia@piefed.social avatar

    This game could have easily been another Marvel Rivals. An absolute success using its strong IPs in a game type that is underrepresented. There's no other big name doing Smash Bros style combat, and definitely not outside of Nintendo's platform. The elements were all there to make this a successful game, but they completely blew the execution.

    dontbelasagne,

    Another problem is the game director overhyping and saying “any character is possibile” and he wasn’t limiting it to warner bros’s IPs but if you’re going to do that, then they honestly should have made the game launch with at least one 3rd party character.

    otacon239, do games w Cyberpunk 2 is now in preproduction, CD Projekt says

    Just another 8-10 years before we get to play it guys!

    Seriously, though. I don’t know how you one-up the first game. I’ve been replaying it and I’m just constantly in awe at the number of hidden little gems to go explore.

    I just found out the text messages you get from Club Riot are for actual events in world and not just flavor text. I haven’t dug into it, but it almost sounded like they had multiple sets of music for the different artists. Just so many little details.

    wirelesswire,

    I would be 100% ok with it being on the same level as the first, just with a different story, characters, etc. Hell, they could reuse 90% of the city as well.

    ampersandrew,
    @ampersandrew@lemmy.world avatar

    It’s going to be in a new city.

    dabaldeagul,
    @dabaldeagul@feddit.nl avatar

    From the same website:

    Pondsmith revealed that he’s not as involved with the second game as he was with 2077, but said he’s keeping track of its progress. The game designer went on to claim that the sequel will feature Night City, as well as a second, unspecified location.

    videogameschronicle.com/…/cyberpunk-2077s-sequel-…

    So it’ll have a new city as well as Night City. Which is good - Night City has more stories to tell. All the TTRPGs were based in NC, as was Edgerunners. Leaving it behind completely would be wrong.

    acosmichippo,
    @acosmichippo@lemmy.world avatar

    other location could be the moon, i think they intended for that to be DLC in 2077.

    Apeman42,
    @Apeman42@lemmy.world avatar

    They did do a lot of teasing of the moon and the Crystal Palace space station, but there are also signs in-game about a high-speed rail line to Chicago opening in 2080. So the “Chicago but wrong” descriptor might be exactly what it says on the tin.

    _cryptagion,

    It’s going to feature a new city as a second location. Night City will still be there in some way, as the story of Cyberpunk is mostly about Night City. If it didn’t have Night City, it would still be cyberpunk, but it wouldn’t be Cyberpunk.

    ThePantser,

    That’s just a DLC then.

    Quetzalcutlass,

    The Saints Row devs are cackling right now.

    acosmichippo,
    @acosmichippo@lemmy.world avatar

    and the spider-man games.

    LandedGentry, (edited )

    deleted_by_author

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  • Quetzalcutlass,

    If CDPR hadn’t forced the team to crunch to get the game running at all on PlayStation, it probably would have been much more polished on release. A lot of the bugs you see in YouTube glitch compilations were due to this over-optimization (like NPCs vanishing or changing models when you looked away for a second).

    I wonder how much better the game and its reception would have been if they’d dropped the last-gen console support during development. Those were the truly awful versions; the PC version was about even with Bethesda’s launch day jank.

    I also wish they’d properly managed expectations. The PC release was buggy and missing promised features, yes, but a lot of the hate came from it being a game with an open-world city with guns and driving but not mimicking GTA’s systems.

    LandedGentry, (edited )

    deleted_by_author

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  • Quetzalcutlass,

    Could you remind me what features people were upset about? I stayed away from most of the drama since CDPR has a long history of releasing a free major upgrade a year or two after release that fixes everything people complained about.

    I remember the dev diaries being pretty open about dropping features during development, like the RC drone turning from a staple of your kit into something shown off once in a mission and immediately forgotten.

    Ushmel,

    braindances being shoehorned into a weird detective bit was a big one. they were supposed to be their own things

    474D,

    Well for one, they had the whole thing about how every NPC would have a full dynamic daily routine to make the city feel alive, and the actual result was, for example, them just walking to and from the metro for 24 hours straight lol

    SupraMario,

    It’s still like that though, the city just feels like it’s just a bunch of npcs standing around. 3am? Same people just wandering around or sitting/leaning somewhere. I really don’t know of a game that has any dynamic npc systems. It’s all just scripted a to b and that’s it.

    Coelacanth,
    @Coelacanth@feddit.nu avatar

    RDR2 is probably the best-feeling in terms of NPC behaviour in the open world.

    SupraMario,

    Agreed, even then though, it’s still got the npc feel. Gta6 is supposed to fix this, but I’m not holding my breath.

    nogooduser,

    I don’t think that the NPC behaviour was the problem but the fact that they promised more. The NPCs didn’t feel significantly different to those in other games for me.

    SupraMario,

    That’s true, I think those who didn’t follow the dev cycle and ate into the hype probably enjoyed the game a ton more than those of us who did and then got the absolute trash day one launch.

    nogooduser,

    I don’t follow games before release so I wasn’t disappointed by missed promises and really enjoyed it.

    The first that I heard of it was how buggy it was so I left it until people were saying the bugs were mostly fixed before getting it on sale.

    MITM0,
    @MITM0@lemmy.world avatar

    They lied about almost everything

    vivendi,

    There is a HUGE compilation on the subreddit for cyberpunk2077, but basically we got promised a vast, in depth RPG and instead got something mechanically on part with GTA Vice City and Call of Duty

    sp3ctr4l,

    That and Nvidia blindsiding them with ‘cool engine you’ve been working on for a decade there… you have one year to jam realtime raytracing into it.’

    Ushmel,

    i was a day 0 PC owner and it was 100% normal launch day fuckery.

    LandedGentry, (edited )

    deleted_by_author

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  • kemsat,

    I also had it on launch day, on PC, and it worked great for me as well. If anything, performance got worse after they patched the game.

    LandedGentry, (edited )

    deleted_by_author

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  • kemsat,

    Some people complain very loudly. It’s possible most of us actually had no problems & said nothing, leaving only the scorned to be heard.

    So, believe it or not, what you said is why I was responding. To let you know “that performance issues are different for different people on different systems.” Seems like you forgot it yourself.

    Have a nice day 😊

    LandedGentry, (edited )

    deleted_by_author

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  • GunValkyrie,

    In your article it talks about how performance was bad on old consoles systems. This is where the refunds were mostly provided. ON PC, many users did not have this issue.

    As you stated everyones PC is different. There’s no gaslighting. You are just conflating statements.

    From your article:

    “Despite good reviews on PC, the console version of Cyberpunk 2077 did not meet the quality standard we wanted it to meet,”

    Your statement directly conflict with the article you shared.

    LucidNightmare,

    Yeah, I had it on PC and while there were plenty of bugs, I still beat it before patch 1.06 or whatever came out. Still had quite a lot of fun!

    Now, the console releases on the other hand… yikes man. Yikes…

    iAmTheTot,

    Well, not being a broken mess without all of the promised features would be a good start towards one-upping it.

    ampersandrew,
    @ampersandrew@lemmy.world avatar

    I don’t know how you one-up the first game.

    Well, after playing Baldur’s Gate 3, I’ve got no shortage of ideas. I really enjoyed Cyberpunk, but “this is the strength option” and “this is the hacker option” are nothing compared to how BG3 lets you come up with your own solutions through its systems.

    Initiateofthevoid,

    “This is the live cannibalism option”

    “… the what?

    chomp

    MITM0,
    @MITM0@lemmy.world avatar

    Have you tried Deus Ex ?

    ampersandrew,
    @ampersandrew@lemmy.world avatar

    Yes, all of them. Wouldn’t hurt to fit more Deus Ex DNA in the game either.

    drzoidberg,
    @drzoidberg@lemmy.world avatar

    I don’t know how you one-up the first game.

    They could release a complete game that’s playable, with the content they claimed would be in it, for starters.

    I mean, honestly, the bar for this sequel to one up its predecessor is pretty low.

    DoucheBagMcSwag,

    Having curated 3rd person cutscenes like the Witcher did would be a fantastic start… Not like they didn’t show that off at E3 or anything…

    VirgilMastercard,

    I have the complete opposite view of 2077. I can’t even finish it before I get bored, and I’ve tried no less than 5 times.

    dual_sport_dork,
    @dual_sport_dork@lemmy.world avatar

    I’ve held multiple times before that it possibly would have been better off if it were a more focused, linear experience possibly akin to how the newer Deus Ex games worked. Within those you had the freedom to screw around in the area/mission you were in and given a wide latitude to complete things as you saw fit, but it definitely excised the wannabe GTA filler in the middle.

    2077 had an excellent series of incredibly well-directed moments, both within the main story missions as well as several notable side missions, but the stuff in between made little sense especially given the story framework of V living on borrowed time with a ticking bomb in their head. But sure, let’s save up and buy nine apartments, collect all the gold class weapons, stock your garage with all the cars, traipse all over down finding all of Delamain’s rogue taxis, do a sidequest for this random chump, see a concert, check all these cyberpsychos off our list…

    There is incredible detail in the world if – but only if – you stop to search for it. There are a lot of things most players will probably miss unless they’re specifically pointed out, and while that’s certainly neat it also means that the lack of discoverability means the time spent on many of those details ultimately turns out to be wasted. 2077 is thus a weird hybrid of a linear and open world game and as a result feels both too constrained and to unfocused at the same time. It’s all to easy to get derailed, and alas to some extent you have to let yourself get derailed to accrue enough XP and equipment so you don’t get your ass handed to you if you just try to stick to the main storyline, even though that storyline is written as if it’s supposed to be a single linear narrative.

    Don’t get me wrong, I still enjoyed the game. I just would have presented it much differently if I were in charge.

    VirgilMastercard,

    Very well put. I feel the same.

    otacon239,

    I can see this perspective, for sure. I definitely didn’t click with this game quite as much with the first go through, but it was the second time where I wanted to build something specific and get into the world more that I had a lot more fun.

    You definitely have to suspend your disbelief with the “ticking time bomb” and I wish the story canonically allowed for exploration after the ending, but I also see how that wouldn’t work that well with some of the endings.

    I think they ultimately had to choose their battles and I’m hoping for a bit less of that in the sequel if anything.

    DoucheBagMcSwag,

    PC version with mods fixes that

    peoplebeproblems,

    I finished it once!

    But then there was an update that broke my character and I can no longer shoot the Overwatch through walls

    wizardbeard,

    Probably update 2.00. They completely redid the game balance, about half of the damn RPG stat related mechanics, and reworked a decent chunk of the iconic weapon effects.

    Notably, they removed the Overwatch sniper’s wall piercing. Intentionally. There’s mods to revert that.

    peoplebeproblems,

    That is relieving to hear. I couldn’t function having a gun that could see through walls but I couldn’t do fuck all about it.

    tauren,

    Seriously, though. I don’t know how you one-up the first game.

    By making the world around the player feel real and alive, for example. Or by hiring QA engineers and listening to their reports. Preferably, both.

    brucethemoose, do games w Cyberpunk 2 is now in preproduction, CD Projekt says

    Spicy take: I hope they dump 2077’s engine and go Unreal.

    I recently followed this guide to try and set up “optimized” path tracing (no raster lighting, with everything raytraced) in 2077, and on my lowly RTX 3090 it runs like cold molasses. Not a chance. Raster + RT reflections is all I can manage, and it looks… good.

    Meanwhile, I’ve also been playing Satisfactory (an Unreal Engine game from a comparatively microscopic studio), and holy moly. Unreal Engine’s dynamic lighting looks scary good. Like, I get light bounces and reflections and everything, and it runs at like quadruple the FPS in hilariously complex areas, again, with a fraction of the dev effort.

    Cryengine in KCD2 is rather sick as well, though probably less tuned for urban landscapes.

    …So why don’t they save a few years and many millions, and just go with one of those instead of poorly reinventing the wheel?

    GunValkyrie,

    I have good news for you. The first information released on the sequel was that it’s being built in unreal.

    brucethemoose,

    That’s what I get for not clicking through!

    Good! I can see a ton of gamers complaining about this, but switching to anything but in-house is a great move IMO.

    simple, do games w MultiVersus officially closes down and is delisted today

    Multiversus was one of the most mismanaged projects I’ve seen. Released in open beta for months, shut down for a year, re-released as literally the same game but worse and with more microtransactions, then quickly died.

    Shame. It was fun to play for a while.

    ampersandrew,
    @ampersandrew@lemmy.world avatar

    I think the mismanagement comes from thinking that any fighting game can keep up with the cadence and business model of League of Legends. You’ll see this again with 2XKO, even if they’ve got a year’s worth of character releases already done ahead of time to give them a head start.

    Zarxrax,

    It really sucked because Smash Bros is basically the only other big platform fighter on the market. Multiversus was set up to actually be a viable alternative to smash, it was massively popular at first, and they had such an amazing library of characters to pull from. The game had everything going for it. And they just blew it. So badly.

    spankmonkey,
    @spankmonkey@lemmy.world avatar

    The beta was fun, although the monetization was bad even back then.

    But the official release made all the wrong decisions to amplify the worst parts of gameplay and dial up the monetization. It was like they got all the player feedback backwards.

    Stovetop,

    The Nickelodeon fighter game is still available I believe, but you’re still right in that there’s still basically nothing to hold a candle to Smash Bros.

    ampersandrew,
    @ampersandrew@lemmy.world avatar

    Rivals of Aether II is a more realistic contender to Smash. It had a really good turnout at Combo Breaker this year.

    Zarxrax,

    I bought the first Nickelodeon game a couple months after it released, and the online was already dead, I literally couldn’t find a match. Just went ahead and got a refund on it.

    celeste, do games w MultiVersus officially closes down and is delisted today
    @celeste@kbin.earth avatar

    I watched some streamers play it and was just wondering why they weren't anymore. Now I know!

    ArchmageAzor, do games w Cyberpunk 2 is now in preproduction, CD Projekt says
    @ArchmageAzor@lemmy.world avatar

    Let’s hope they learned how to properly pace development and to handle a launch this time around.

    A_Random_Idiot, do games w Cyberpunk 2 is now in preproduction, CD Projekt says

    I don’t care.

    Shut up about the game.

    Don’t fucking say a thing about it until its like 6 months from launch.

    Did they learn nothing from last time?!

    dubyakay,

    Learn what? They’ve been relativly silent throughout the 12 years from announcement to release.

    supercriticalcheese,

    You can start any time, for example ignore the news?

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