So I have a lot of thoughts on this that I have repeatedly failed to word in a way that I am happy with, so I am going to sideline a lot of those to focus on some more high-level thoughts:
As many have noted, there would probably be significantly better discussion happening if the ideas in the post were framed in a less antagonistic way. While I don’t think the post should be removed, it has been reported multiple times as “obvious rage-bait”, and I have a hard time disagreeing with that view. It is hard to take criticisms of things you like when the tone of that criticism is condescending and antagonistic. This isn’t helped by all the “reasons” given are very subjective and vague, with no concrete examples given to give a reader any context for what you think falls in these categories. In my experience, this type of “conversation” (I hesitate to call it a “conversation” because I think the structure makes having an actual conversation nearly impossible) is really prevalent amongst men who studied STEM and Redditors. Rather than a discussion about preferences in games and strengths/weaknesses of different storytelling styles, it encourages “I’m right, you’re wrong” argumentation, which just won’t be as fruitful and serves mostly to build tension within the community. For me personally, while I do think the ideas in the post make for interesting discussions/conversations, I don’t believe it is possible when this is the initial framing. I hope we can avoid this discussion/argumentation style on beehaw.
As for a more general thoughts on the contents of the post: this feels like it could be condensed down to “I only like a very specific and limited type of storytelling and view anything outside of that as lesser and flawed.” It is also comes off as a very simplistic and “rationalist” analysis of storytelling. It is focused only on tropes and structure and ignores how those tropes might be used to emphasize a theme, or the emotional impact of those stories.
I agree with you fully! Only thing I did not really like is the part about this sort of communication being “really prevalent amongst men who studied STEM and Redditors”. I know you prefaced it with “in my experience”, but it still feels a bit generalizing and not really relevant to the rest of the post. I think the behaviour should be called out, but pinning it on a group always feels a bit “us vs them”. Feel free to reply and discuss further, unlike OP I am looking for connection and mutual understanding :)
I agree that video game narratives are, on average, way worse than in other media, but… This post is like a script for a CinemaSins video on an entire medium. There’s a conversation to be had about the quality and originality of storytelling in video games and why gamers are so quick to praise mediocre narratives, but I dunno if glib one-paragraph summaries of “types” of video game stories (with no examples!) do much to advance that conversation.
There’s a conversation to be had about the quality and originality of storytelling in video games and why gamers are so quick to praise mediocre narratives,
No, there’s really not. This is just a condescending way to disreguard someone else opinion on a piece of media or writing you dislike. The simple answer is just that thehly legitimately thought it was good.
I’m so tired of people acting like they’re some keepers of “good” content because they have the nonsense notion that media/writing is obectively good/bad. Want to talk about a film you just really liked online? Nope, it’s “objectively” bad writing, therefore you have terrible taste for liking it (or get called worse). I was hoping discussions like this would be better here.
I was actually being facetious. Maybe it seems like a throwback or whatever now, but back when DNF finally released, the “tiny player, big world” idea was rather played out. Duke Burger felt very dated and out-of-place in a game where you’re supposed to be this big macho badass because suddenly you can get stomped on or crushed by small kitchen objects. The level itself is a maze of almost entirely platform jumping puzzles and totally overstays its welcome. But I guess it looks kinda cool and does sort of break the monotony of a bad game.
Other games (and especially player-made maps) in the late 90’s did it much better. I especially remember custom levels for its predecessor, Duke Nukem 3D, that had a lot of fun with the shrunken player concept. HL and Quake too like you mention. Folks here also said de_rats in Counter Strike which might’ve been the pinnacle.
Deus Ex: Human Revolution and Mankind Divided can be played as stealth games, and I really liked them. Note that they aren’t “pure” stealth games, there are some encounters where you cannot avoid fighting.
Also DE:MD kind of ends in the middle, so if you are a story player you will be frustrated to know that there seem to be no plans for the next sequel.
Yeah HR had unavoidable combat bosses in its original release. The Director’s Cut modded them all to allow for dealing with them by alternative means, such as hacking, robot/turret control and such. But because they weren’t originally designed that way it’s not the most organic, and you can’t pure stealth bypass them like the original Deus Ex.
Haven’t seen this concept for a while. I remember playing shit out of Airfix Dogfighter, where you were basically controlling a plane model from WW2 and fighting around the house with other planes. Great game
Man, this post brought me back memories of Unreal Tournament (and 2k4) and now I feel very nostalgic for all those custom maps and weapons. Used to spend so much time playing giant insta-gib deathmatches (and when I had all the time in my late-teens/early 20s). Wish that game is still supported.
What are your opinions on Xonotic? It’s a FPS that borrows many things from Quake and UT games, features a lot of modes and has an active online community, so I think it could provide a similar feel?
I used to play a ton of Quake 3 Rails only Instagib! I was hosting a Q3 server for a while not long ago, but just didn’t have the time to dedicate to it. Might be fun to spin up again. It would run 24/7 with bots so I’d just hop in and out during lunch downtime or something.
Lots of great suggestions already but I want to throw in another recommendation for Splinter Cell. The series lost it’s identity later on, but Chaos Theory still holds up in my opinion with some great levels.
I haven’t actually played it yet, but HYPERCHARGE: Unboxed has been in my Steam library for ages. That looks like it may scratch your itch …
I really miss some “toy soliders” 3D shoot-em-up that I can just baaaaaaarely remember from the 1990s … does anybody remember the game I’m thinking about? (There was definitely a series, I distinctly recall the name ending in “2” …)
bin.pol.social
Aktywne