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SSJ2Marx, do gaming w You can't sue us for making games 'too entertaining,' say major game developers in response to addiction lawsuits
@SSJ2Marx@hexbear.net avatar

Unfortunately the more I read the less this seems like a long overdue accounting of the video game industry’s hubris and the more it seems like someone with looking for someone to blame for their failson. These companies have literally hired psychologists to come up with ways to more effectively manipulate their players into buying their digital bullshit, and surprise surprise many of the things those psychologists have come up with are basically unregulated gambling.

I wonder if this is a false flag?

doom_and_gloom, (edited ) do gaming w You can't sue us for making games 'too entertaining,' say major game developers in response to addiction lawsuits
@doom_and_gloom@lemmy.ml avatar

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  • TheBroodian,

    Surely there’s an instance somewhere of the government suing itself phoenix-think

    Gradually_Adjusting, do games w 'The gold rush is over:' Slay the Spire and Darkest Dungeon devs say that big Game Pass and Epic exclusive deals have dried up for indie devs
    @Gradually_Adjusting@lemmy.world avatar

    Hawkish monetary policy has a way of making it hard to turn a profit on long horizon projects.

    wccrawford, do gaming w So, looks like Putin's ordered the Russian government to 'consider the issue of organising' domestic versions of the Steam Deck, SteamOS, and Steam itself (with a side order of Steam Machines)

    Oh wow. I can’t wait to watch that shit show play out.

    mindbleach, do gaming w You can't sue us for making games 'too entertaining,' say major game developers in response to addiction lawsuits

    People don’t drink because vodka tastes good, assholes. “You’re still playing!” is not proof of enjoyment.

    MeetInPotatoes, do gaming w You can't sue us for making games 'too entertaining,' say major game developers in response to addiction lawsuits

    This is the same as Trump saying he was just challenging the results of the election.

    Namely, nobody is trying to prosecute him for his legal challenges…and nobody is complaining that games are too entertaining. They are bold strawman arguments that most people see through immediately. “Complete bullshit” is now a common argumentative tactic.

    peanuts4life, do gaming w You can't sue us for making games 'too entertaining,' say major game developers in response to addiction lawsuits
    @peanuts4life@lemmy.blahaj.zone avatar

    In some respects, I can see this. Games such as unscrupulous MMOs are often carefully engineered to distort your ability to manage time and money. However, many games are still produced as entertainment products meant to compete on a basis of artistic or entertainment value. The addictive aspect doesn’t come from a manipulative design, but Rather just plain old fun, and in those cases similar arguments could be made about strawberries or books.

    I would like to reiterate that there are addictive video games which really do try to manipulate you. Just like how a breakfast cereal might market itself as healthy and balanced while loaded with sugar and deceptive portion sizes, leading to unhealthy habits, a money first video game will contain elements carefully crafted to distort player’s perception and reasoning.

    It’s just… All mixed together.

    Dagrothus,

    Gamers can understand this. Casinos understand this. But how do you articulate the difference to a court or actually legislate against it? FOMO is usually used in a predatory way, like with daily rewards. Paid random lootboxes are definitely predatory, but other rng systems can be genuinely fun. Not an easy problem to solve without stepping on toes.

    Dailies are probably something that could be solved with targetted legislation. Harmful to player mental health just to boost stats for investors. Some games need to limit progression, but there are loads of ways to do so other than dailies.

    TexasDrunk,

    I can’t get into the whole debate because I’m not knowledgeable enough to articulate the difference between a genuinely good game and games using skinnerbox mechanics to force operant conditioning. However, I have an anecdote.

    I used to play a mobile game that was mid level fun, but a very obvious skinnerbox with time based turns (energy? Mana stones? Hell, I don’t remember), daily and weekly battles, sporadic new releases where you had a chance to get some kind of cool stuff, and clan activities. I had to put it down for a couple of weeks due to real life and just never picked it back up. I still talk to some of the guys on discord but after not being on every day I stopped caring about the game entirely.

    BolexForSoup,
    @BolexForSoup@kbin.social avatar

    I know people tend to joke about having a Civ addiction, but the number of people who have in fact binged an entire night or more playing civilization and have experience addiction like relationships with it should tell you that the line is thinner than I think most people are comfortable with.

    Few games are “just good old fashioned fun.” Every game is designed to draw our attention. The distinctions between intent/accident, “it’s just fun”/designed to be addicting, etc. are not always very clear.

    thingsiplay, do gaming w You can't sue us for making games 'too entertaining,' say major game developers in response to addiction lawsuits

    Heisenberg approves this.

    Hobbes_Dent, do gaming w You can't sue us for making games 'too entertaining,' say major game developers in response to addiction lawsuits

    This is really a thing?

    Where do I line up to give my victim impact statement on the quality and longevity of games?

    Zoomboingding, do games w Power-mad modder puts Sonic the Hedgehog at the heart of the most tedious game ever made, so you can speed boost to the end in 3 straight hours instead of 8.
    @Zoomboingding@lemmy.world avatar

    I hope Loading Ready Run finds this

    KingThrillgore, do gaming w How are CD Projekt's side quests so good? Cyberpunk quest designer says they reject 'over 90%' of their pitches
    @KingThrillgore@lemmy.ml avatar

    I did some research on quest system design and found a Unity plugin that reduced them down to basically eight core tasks, which means you treat it like data entry. Just have the writers draft up the elements at each part of the timeline and fuck it. Have to think more holistically and probably do the writing first, tasks once you’re happy with where to go.

    li10, do gaming w How are CD Projekt's side quests so good? Cyberpunk quest designer says they reject 'over 90%' of their pitches

    Meanwhile, other games just pick 5 basic templates then make 200 side quests based off those.

    I do not understand how people can still play assassin’s creed.

    Carighan, (edited )
    @Carighan@lemmy.world avatar

    Let’s not pretend that the vast majority of CP2077’s side quests are not that type of C&P’ed filler crap.

    They are.

    What is significant about CP2077 is how a dozen or so side quests are incredibly stellar, far outdoing even the main (non-expansion) story quest. They’re incredibly good. That’s just a few ones sadly, but they’re big and have lots of interactions and cool moments though, they almost feel like the main quests in a lot of ways.

    _ed,

    Yep. Compared to W3 felt like more busywork in CP2077

    JeffreyOrange,

    I get how people didn’t like them. But I had a ton of fun doing the NCPD busywork. The gameplay was engaging enough to entertain me. If you don’t have a lot of time to play video games ut’s sometimes frustrating to watch an hour of cutscenes and only play for a couple minutes. The story was great but it gave me the option to just play.

    p03locke,
    @p03locke@lemmy.dbzer0.com avatar

    I do not understand how people can still play assassin’s creed.

    Raycevick described it really well.

    teawrecks, do gaming w 'Make a private hosted version of your game': Knockout City dev's top tip for studios shutting down a live service game is to give players the keys

    This should be a legal requirement, imo. It’s unreasonable for them to sell a game to people, and then make it impossible to play because they weren’t making enough anymore. That’s like making a movie unwatchable because dvd sales dropped

    tias,

    Oh but they’re not selling it, they’re leasing it.

    teawrecks,

    I would use the term “licensing” rather than leasing. A video rental store “leases” the license.

    But the point is, they’re selling you a license to play the game, and then at some point after sale, without you knowing when or why, they rescind the license without compensating you. Any reasonable person would think that purchasing a game means a license to play it indefinitely, especially if you received some kind of binary in exchange for money at the point of sale.

    It’s the difference between Uber offering a subscription model, but then a year later suddenly saying they don’t offer it anymore, vs Tesla selling you a car, but a year later disabling features on it, saying, “you were merely licensing/leasing those features”.

    JDPoZ, do games w Power-mad modder puts Sonic the Hedgehog at the heart of the most tedious game ever made, so you can speed boost to the end in 3 straight hours instead of 8.
    @JDPoZ@lemmy.world avatar

    They should make it so you can find chaos emeralds and turn into super or maybe even “hyper” sonic to go double or triple the speed

    RedWeasel, do games w Power-mad modder puts Sonic the Hedgehog at the heart of the most tedious game ever made, so you can speed boost to the end in 3 straight hours instead of 8.

    Give me a cannonball run that has real roads and realistic speed and traffic

    bigmclargehuge,
    @bigmclargehuge@lemmy.world avatar

    This is what I always wanted from The Crew. It’s sense of scale is all off though

    Rentlar,

    Did you see the news The Crew is Shutting Down their servers in April? If you bought this game, and live somewhere where your consumer protection agencies might have teeth you could help this guy put up a defense against companies bricking games you paid for.

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