Seven dollars to loading screen to your ship, watch an animation of your character sitting down, loading screen to space, loading screen to the system it’s in, Dodge some pirates, loading screen to the surface, hop along the completely barren landscape to go to a copy pasted outpost, loading screen back to your ship?
I feel like you could get all of the value of that dlc by just playing a mission over again.
This…this right here is the reason I quit playing this game, the reason I couldn’t quite put my finger on. It was just too fucking disjointed, you are so right.
I didn’t make it very far in to the game, I’d held on to my game pass subscription just waiting for it to come out, and cancelled my game pass after a few hours in Starfield. I made it to like the first big city a few small settlements after that, and everything felt so fucking lifeless. NPCs just didn’t seem to belong in the space they inhabited. Oblivion and Skyrim NPCs really seemed like they owned the space they inhabited. Fallout 4 even once you got your settlements going really felt like they were home. The constant loading screens just made everything feel like it’s own little universe, apart from the rest of the game. I did have fun raiding some base around the moon, one of the few times I had fun exploring. One of the few times I had fun, honestly.
The most fun I had in Starfield was probably a zero-G fight at one point, can’t remember if it was the main storyline or not. But I got as far as the final main quest line fight, after which New Game+ would become available. I realized before going into it that…I just didn’t care. And I am not one to experience the sunken cost fallacy. So I just logged out, canceled Xbox PC Game Pass, and did something else.
I haven’t played this so take my 2 cents with a pinch of mixed metaphor.
My assumption for this game was that DLC would be new copy pasted outposts, weapons, etc. That’s the way a lot of procedural games go. It’s not bad really, you take a good core game and pump it full of new set pieces and toys til hell freezes over.
Bethesda just released an expansion for fallout 76. It’s a game that I’m fairly fond of, considering the amount of dislike I have for fallout 4, it improved on it in every way from the worldbuilding to building to the story, I could go on, point is, I like it.
The new expansion, the first map expansion and like 20 major updates in.
The new map is quite a large region. You’d expect a few side quests to unlock these other locations. Maybe some hidden gems. Maybe some cool NPCs outside of the main “expansion” right?
Its literally: A main quest that’s short (beat it in like 3 hours on the first day it dropped)
A single side quest that’s more of an optional objective on the main quest
A single new event
A single new boss.
Four things they added. Two of which can only be done once (bad formula for a game designed around repeating similar tasks)
They’ve just straight up gotten bad. There’s no love in their products anymore. It’s all taking the easiest way out, lacking any amount of real creativity.
I just want them to migrate from their shitty proprietary engine, buckle down on a good story and prioritizing fun.
The thing with those is that, while it was a small amount of content, it wasn’t just a mission, each was about an hour of repeatable content that was fairly fun to farm. At $2, they actually still felt worth it with as much fun as B2 was. If they had asked for like $10 each, people would have flipped out.
I’m not a Starfield player, but I would bet this is not even close to as good of a value proposition.
Can you play it on a PS5? The console that I mentioned that is outselling the Xbox 2 to 1? And both FO and Elder Scrolls will be exclusive. Again, they’re not making good decisions over there.
I didn’t mention PC. What I’m talking about isn’t about PC. It’s about consoles and their decision to side with Microsoft and lose money.
I swear gamers have the memory of a gnat. How many times has Bethesda pulled shit like this and people continue to support them? no one remembers the Horse armor all the way back in Oblivion? no one remembers the Skyrim paid mods in 2015? hell can’t even remember the SKYRIM PAID MODS IN DEC OF 2023!
This isn’t an outrage and no one should be upset AT Bethesda over this, but disappointed and upset with yourselves for yet again falling for their constant desire to nickel and dime their playerbase.
Nothing will stand in the way of getting their current precious. Not even their own complaints and bitching.
They’ll sit there and complain about how a company is evil, its practices exploitative, and how everyone should avoid buying from them so they can die in the fires of Bankruptcy.
Then the second the next game/expansion/DLC/Whatever is announced, they are immediately in line to preorder the ultra deluxe mega fuck you 500 dollar package. because it comes with a unique mount and a special armor skin, and they just cant miss those things! they’re rare! and they’ll never be able to get them otherwise! /s
And then they’ll go into the obfuscated-cash-shop and spend another 700 dollars on digital bullshit.
Then, when they are all done, the overwhelming majority of them will come back to the internet, and cry and whinge and moan about how a company is evil, its practices exploitative, and how everyone should avoid buying from them so they can finally die in the fires of bankruptcy.
Cause the majority of gamers are brain damaged fucktards who, at the end of the day, just love throwing their wallet at things.
I mean this is kind of true of all people everywhere. The marshmallow test has flaws but I think it’s still revealing. A lot of people are really bad at self control and delayed gratification.
Don’t know. Don’t play a whole lot of Bethesda games. Didn’t play Oblivion. New gamers join the ranks every day. Not everyone has been gaming since the 80’s.
Well most modern gamers are probably like 14 years old and probably never even played Skyrim. So I’m not surprised young kids are buying this creation kit garbage with Mommy’s credit card.
Starfield could have been a way better game if all they did was fuck it up like 45% less. They could have alternatively just delivered on their promises of making the game easy to mod and let the community handle the rest but they fucked that up too. Only the most dedicated of Starfield fan would have the patience to sit down and do all the shit it takes to add a new quest for example. Iirc even Skyrim came with a mod editor with ui that was easy to understand. Right now all we have is a community xedit project that’s somehow even harder to run on Linux than Starfield is.
Starfield’s big problem is it’s a huge universe built on an engine that really can’t support massive worlds like that. The reason you can’t fly around on the surface of a planet is because their crappy engine can’t cope with that much space existing, and it can’t load more environment when you get to the edges like every other game does because their engine doesn’t support proper level streaming.
If you mod the game to force the issue it gets glitchy very very quickly.
The Starfield Creation Kit was only released a week ago (but I think to remember that there was a big delay in its release for Skyrim and Fallout, too - haven’t done any modding since the Skyrim days).
Starfield could have been a way better game if all they did was fuck it up like 45% less.
Compared to the KOTOR series, it was lifeless. Compared to Mass Effect, it was very boring. Frustrating for a game with such strong precedents to land so weakly. But they put so much energy into quantity of content that they forgot to invest in quality.
They could have alternatively just delivered on their promises of making the game easy to mod and let the community handle the rest but they fucked that up too.
The goal was to create a game that procedurally generated itself, not one where individual hobbyists expanded it manually.
There was this editor that let you make esm files. I can’t remember if it was already in the game folder or you had to download from steam but it must not have been hard to set up. I remember using it to make one of the buyable houses really big on the inside.
Is repetitive buying of Bethesda games a new kind of litmus test for stupidity? I mean they do this shit constantly and people are still surprised when it happens. Did people really forget horse armor they tried to sell? Or forget about items that were free in Fallout 4, but had to be purchased in 76? It’s Bethesda and only one thing Todd dreams about is scamming another dollar from their fans.
Used to be that they’d sell you both worthless DLC and actually good DLC.
Knights of the Nine?* Awesome. Horse Armor? Worthless.
Similarly, Skyrim had Dawnguard and Dragonborn which were great. It also had Hearthfire which was kinda meh, but at least it had stuff to do and was cheap, so I’m not too mad about it.
*There was also Shivering Isles, but at the time that was marketed as an expansion pack, not merely a DLC.
Bethesda announced that players could download a new series of missions for a group known as the Track Alliance. The problem is that The Vulture is the second mission in the Tracker Alliance, and it costs $7 to buy. But it’ll actually cost players $10 because they must purchase 1,000 Starfield creation credits to afford it.
So they put the first mission out for free, but it turns out the first mission was a fucking advertisement. I remember being super pissed when Dragon Age pulled this shit.
And of course they pull the classic cost-obfuscation trick because it would just be far too convenient to just be able to buy a DLC for actual money and then download it.
Eh, skill up had a great take on this. The thing is it’s wayyyyy easier to be a small indie developer than it ever was before. Making a game (or any art) still isn’t easy, it never was and never will be, but it’s viable without a giant publisher in a way it just hasn’t been before.
Its the AA titles that are on the most precarious footing, but I bet even those do ok. Don’t get me wrong, I enjoy some AAA stuff time to time, I’ve got a stupid amount of hours in overwatch, but I’ve never once paid for a skin because… why would you?
The thing that’s going to suck is losing the studios like Arkane. Their games weren’t perfect but they were freaking cool, and they basically always got the raw end of the deal. Even Prey(2016), their masterpiece, is the product of corporate bullshitiery they had nothing to do with. So we’re probably going to miss studios like that for a while (as they get re-tasked to fortnite/cod support teams) but “indie” stuff has already been stepping up to fill that void, and is less indie all the time.
Look at Dave the Diver. That’s not exactly an indie studio. They had resources. There’s going to be a gap for a bit, but there’s still a demand for good games and art. Those AA breakthroughs are what people want. Again, I continue to spend dumb amounts of time on overwatch, but it’s not where I spend my money. Microsoft hovelled themselves by buying all these studios and not taking the leap with supporting them. Distribution just doesn’t have the value it once did. So if microsoft wants to become CandyCrush, feeding an addiction loop to grab the whales, sure, whatever, but there’s plenty of bread out there for studios doing other stuff.
The one and only point that I disagree with you on is your take on mtx. They may not affect you, but everything about them is designed to be psychologically exploitative, and the wealthy whale is largely a myth. The vast majority of money from mtx is made from people with addiction issues and other mental health issues or atypical neurology, like people with depression or ADHD.
Microsoft bought up all those studios and didn’t support them, but that’s business as usual for Microsoft, and the money that they’ll make from mtx like this will more than make up for it. I recently watched a former Blizzard dev who was talking about how a single $15 mount for WoW made more money than StarCraft 2 did.
The big issue I see is that most people largely don’t know about anything beyond the big AAA releases, and as we’ve already established, that’s an exploitative wasteland nowadays. There’s plenty of demand for good games and there always will be, but while the indie scene is the best that’s it’s ever been, the majority of indie companies go under after their first game. It’s still hard out there for them, too. There’s just enough of them popping up and putting out truly great games that they can actually compete with the AAA space.
It was Thor from pirate software on Twitch talking about the mtx beating SC2 for folks who care great guy to watch if you want to chill and hear some good life advise.
oh yeah, I didn’t want to be dismissive of the mtx stuff. It’s absolutely predatory and awful, but I don’t think it fully stands in the way of developing good games.
Which is related to what you’re saying about indies going under even after success. Game development takes time, and you need money to underwrite that time. I just think there’s going to be a split; right now AAA studios are shitifying their games, turning them more into CandyCrush skinner boxes. But the demand for good games hasn’t gone away, there’s just less financial upside than making CandyCrush. My point is, even though it’s less money, there’s still a good amount of money to be had there. Eventually the gaps going to be filled. Microsoft cant fill it because on the balance sheet, things like COD and anything from King are where they should be focused. And it sucks right now because they sucked up a stupid amount of talent and thanos snapped them, but thats not a sustainable practice.
But yes, it’s going to be painful. It’ll suck seeing really nifty indie stuff have to struggle so hard. Like I said I’m also going to miss the polish that comes with AA stuff. I’m going to miss the hell out of Arkane. Their games weren’t perfect, but they had so much soul. They didn’t deserve to have Redfall be their epitaph.
I kind of feel like anyone who spends $20 on a video game skin shouldn’t be allowed to make any financial decisions for themselves. Like, it was a test and you failed.
Except that shit is designed by literal psychologists to prey upon people with poor fiscal responsibility, like people with ADHD, depression, addiction issues, and kids.
It’s like blaming people for smoking cigarettes after they got addicted from secondhand smoking.
It’s fucked because there are people buying that shit, in numbers that turn a profit over the cost of developing it. And it’s a very low cost because the skin support is something they put in when they make the game, and then get an intern to shit out a gaudy skin.
If you don’t like it you’re obviously not the target demographic anymore. It’s mobile gaming tactics creeping their way on PC.
It should be standard practice for Bethesda games to wait for a game of the year edition (or whatever they want to call it) then wait for a steam sale on that.
This only works because it’s like $30. If this was a $60-70 game, I don’t think it goes over well with the public. Nintendo is the only one that seems to get away with that
I think that’s exactly the point though. “We didn’t mark it up to mark it down, the price is just the price”. As a chronic patient gamer part of me hates that (I love finding older classics for like $10) but I don’t mind shelling out for a good game. The biggest expense is my time, and if a bunch of years later the price hasn’t moved it’s probably worth my time.
Yeah a lot of these entertainment companies forget that they need to earn my business with high quality product AND services, otherwise I will take matters into my own hands.
This aint like housing and work, where they can just fuck you as if they are your prison guards. We got options baby!
I got starfield for free with my video card, and I still feel ripped off and wish I could refund lol.
But yeah, I’m not dropping a single goddamn penny on Starfield. It feels like a game that was made for the xbox 360 or something, with all the loading screens and shit.
Who cares? The community will have player made expansions in a year that will likely be free and of higher quality.
Regardless, BGS is a shell of its former self. Whenever I see people clamoring for TES 6 I just scratch my head and ask why?
Starfield was the final straw for me, I will never get excited for another Bethesda game again. They’ve shown that they refuse to truly shake up their game design. When people asked if Starfield would have the same magic as FO3 or older TES games, they said, “it’ll have the same DNA.” I assumed that meant it’d have fun exploration and interesting quests. While it has some decent quests, the exploration is utterly tedious and just unfun. I truly wish they’d had just focused on fleshing out 2 or 3 planets in one solar system, maybe some instanced, hand-crafted dungeons/whatever outside of it. I have zero interest in exploring proc gen worlds, it’s not that fun in No Man’s Sky and it’s not fun here. At least with NMS, it’s all relatively seamless.
FO4 is why I waited and ultimately didn’t buy starfield. I LOVED elderscrolls, and FO:NV is like my alltime favorite. I didn’t hate FO4, there’s some fun to be had, but you can see pretty clearly from it where FO:76 came from. From what I’ve seen and read, I’m not missing anything with starfield.
NMS is tough. They did an amazing job trying to salvage it, but it will always be a game that was never meant to be that big. It’s not bad but at somepoint in the loop you just go “wtf am I doing?”. I give that team all the credit in the world, but that game never belonged where it is.
New Vegas is notable for not being a Bethesda game per se. It uses something very close to the Fallout 3 engine, but the actual content has little to do with Bethesda. They did publish it, though.
Oh I’m well aware lol. The game is a godamn miracle. But thats the thing, Bethesda has been on this trajectory for a good lonnnnnng while. Like the whole “obsidian good bethesda bad” thing isn’t quite right, but what is true is Bethesda has been incredibly strategic about shittifying their games: there’s always just enough there to keep you going “ok… one more”.
Starfield is the first one I just didn’t even bother with.
For myself and many people Skyrim is the best game they’ve ever played. It was the first fantasy game I played since Runescape to have multiple cities spread out through an open world, with long narrative multi stage quests involving a number of locations and NPCs. Both games also have a leveling sytem based around you get better at what you use ie “skilling”.
I want “TES 6” in that I want another game that hits those marks, but I no longer trust Bethesda to make it.
Edit: note I know a lot of people dislike skyrim and think calling it a great game is absurd, and I get the criticism but I love the game anyway
To me that was oblivion, when I got skyrim I just felt burnt out because it felt so similar but at the same time missing some of the stuff I liked like the custom spells etc, then fallout 4 came out and I sort of shelved it but once I got into it I spent soo many hours on it. Maybe it’s like cod now where if you skip a few years it’s fun again but not every single game because they just aren’t that different
Only if you don’t buy the Season 1 Vault-Tec Access Pass for $49.99. Imagine not doing that and then not ever being able to get your Overpowered Armor at pass level 5. You would absolutely be ruining it for yourself by not investing into the seasonal passes.
Look the perk system was bad but it’s wasn’t Fallout New Vegas bad. It was okay for a Fallout game but they probably should’ve done level ups by doing each 5 levels gives you 2 SPECIAL points to spend rather than spending normal points on the core stats.
As an RPG player, people kept saying I should play Fallout, but I never have because it always looked more like a shooter than an RPG, and I want to play an actual RPG, not a shooter with RPG elements (especially because I despise shooters).
In all the previous shooter Fallouts, you can basically use VATS to never have to aim yourself if that’s what you want to do (or melee build!), it’s like an auto-aimer. You won’t miss that much and maybe that way you can enjoy the universe.
Fallout 3 was all around an inferior game. Not just an inferior fallout, but an inferior game, compared to 4.
Mostly cause Fallout 3 was a disjointed mess.
But just because Fallout 4 is better by comparison, Doesnt mean fallout 4 is good.
I hate beets. But give me the choice between a bowl of shit and a bowl of beets, and put a gun to my head? I’ll eat the beets gladly and happily. Doesnt mean I love them.
Neither is shit. 4 is way better. 1, 2, and New Vegas are better still. But 3 doesn’t tend to come up in these conversations when people talk about Bethesda Fallouts being worse. They always go to 4, and that surprises me.
Fallout 3’s world doesn’t feel like Fallout but the tone of the writing comes close.
Fallout 4’s tone and writing doesn’t feel like Fallout, but the world does.
New Vegas is the only 3D Fallout game that feels like Fallout in both the world and the writing.
I can almost guarantee that unless Josh Sawyer and the other original talent that made 1, 2, and tactics that also worked on New Vegas are working on it, it will never feel like a true Fallout game.
I would love for Obsidian to get another crack at Fallout, but I don’t think they are the only ones capable of making a good fallout game (though they would undoubtly be the best).
It just takes passion for the property, and a vested interest in the world. Something Bethesda is clearly lacking. Bethesda seems to be in the phase of “throw darts at a bunch of sticky notes on the wall” of trying to figure out how to make a game, and it just leads to a disjointed experience.
Obsidian is off doing things and making games better than Fallout, they’d only come back because their studio isn’t extremely profitable and needs the cash.
Really though, please just go buy their games and play them. Outer Worlds got slated as pretty average but I’m still really excited to play that and Outer Worlds 2.
I liked Outer Worlds, but while I do see some “NV magic” there, it feels like both Bethesda AND Obsidian are no longer the same companies that they once were. Obsidian are still quietly putting out some solid games…but not to the same quality of two generations prior.
The only bad thing about it is idiot gamers heard the basic premise, and that Obsidian was making it, and immediately stroked their hype boners up over “OMG NEW VEGAS IN SPACE!” when it was nothing of the sort.
For me it’s the fundamental difference in design philosophy. Bethesda does power fantasies, which works great for TES, but not for Fallout. You should be barely scraping by, not making the wasteland your bitch.
Once you take high school English your teacher will tell you not to write “in my opinion” in front of everything you write because it is unnecessary. Of course it is your option, you said it.
Someone with basic logic can extrapolate from that that if someone says something like “Fallout 4 is bad” that is clearly someone presenting an opinion and not an objective truth.
I hate having discussions. Opinions aren’t allowed to be held because theres always some entitled ass that has to come in and misrepresent what everyones saying so they can fulfill their personal fantasy of being offended and attacked.
gamespot.com
Aktywne