I'm curious on how signers of this petition think companies could afford to do this. Often times shutting a game down is because the interest of players has waned. Making a law to require them to keep that server and software running...forever? Is the end goal to kill any online game development?
It would make sense to require a company to release the code for players to host their own servers, which has been done by many games in the past. Not to continue to run it themselves.
The company will have the make that decision then, if it means opening the server for use or patching the game for local p2p play then so be it. Otherwise they should be forced to state the game is a rental not purchased if it requires a server that may shut down.
Otherwise they should be forced to state the game is a rental not purchased if it requires a server that may shut down.
But that is what they already do. Currently this might be hidden in the EULA, that no one reads, but even making this plainly visible during purchase wouldn't change much. I is not like the players have much choice when they want to play that specific game.
I think part of the next phase is to force the companies to list a minimum supported life span, I think the average length a game is supported for now days is around two years, so if the game isn’t kept alive the minimum listed time you get a refund but if the life span of the game is listed too short then people will be less likely to spend money on it
That’s sort of what they do, except they still call it a purchase. I’ve never seen the word ‘rental’ on any game store. They shouldn’t be allowed to even call it a purchase if it isn’t one.
This is why we got Stadia. Imagine Netflix where you pay a monthly fee and still have to buy all the movies and shows at full price. That was Stadia’s model.
Thos erodes the concept of ownership so that it is substituted for rental, without stating that clearly. Stadia failed but in doing so it probably helped Microsoft figure out how to eventually get away with doing the exact same thing.
Games should clearly say if you’re basically renting them, not have it buried in the EULA. Let publishers full price and let consumers decide if they are prepared to live with it.
Looking at the petition itself it wasn't very specific on the terms, which is why I questioned the very broadness of the request . "Keep" implies maintaining how it is currently, not a transition to open source and player run.
It’s true it does cost to keep things running. But like you say there are ways around this to push server costs onto players, or simply allow offline play with online features disabled.
I think if there were legislation in place then design decisions would adapt. If it were costly to just shut a game down abruptly, there would be player hosted options in place from the start and ideally less spurious “always online” requirements woven into the fabric of every game.
It would make sense to require a company to release the code for players to host their own servers, which has been done by many games in the past. Not to continue to run it themselves.
That’s basically what people are asking for. Instead of not being playable anymore, give consumers the means to keep it going for themselves.
This could mean always-online having to be gutted from the game after it’s support ends so you can play it offline. Or server hosting files to host your own private or public server.
The goal is to have games not be impossible to play after X amount of time. How companies reach that goal is up to them.
Ross and the team have been very specific about not wanting to force companies to pay for server infrastructure forever.
They’ve said quite a few times that what they want is for game companies to at least patch their games so they can keep running without the online connection or provide players the tools to host their own servers so that the company can end support without the game becoming a brick.
Hopefully by requiring games to be playable after support ends and the servers shut down it will also change the way games are made so that they no longer require the constant connection.
I would also wonder how this would work with MMOs where the server side, both in processing power and in bandwidth, is not insignificant. I mean I suppose “are required to publish the code, no requirement that it’s feasible for others to run” but…yeah.
He talks about that. I think the gist is that a lot of games that are online services could run locally, the publisher just chooses not to. That’s why Ross chose the Crew 2 as his hill to die on: there’s evidence that an offline does/did exist and just wasn’t enabled. That’s a practice that needs to be challenged.
The argument goes that a game that relies on server side technology to run in any form shouldn’t be sold as a product that you can own. This needs to be reflected in the price and licensing model. That seems fair.
The big question is why TF we’re at a point where a company should be allowed to sell you a product and say you own it then remove your right to use the product arbitrarily. I bet there’s IP in the server side code, but having a system where a corporation’s IP and ability to make money from the IP is more important that the concept of ownership is deeply fucked up.
Technology Tangents did a video where a game he bought on CD and tried to play on period-correct hardware won’t run because there was DRM that called a server to check the date and to make sure it wasn’t leaked early. Decades after the release, the server is gone and the game can’t run, ironically, because it’s so far outside of its release date. That’s the kind of bullshit that absolutely shouldn’t be tolerated.
I’m aware of good old fashioned multiplayer where an average Pentium 2 rig has enough grunt to host a multiplayer session and be one of the client machines, obviously games of that scale should be able to be run by enthusiasts. I’m talking about, what if something like WoW shuts down?
Wow private servers aren’t uncommon, although I do think they violate the TOS as it stands. I imagine people would continue to use those in the event blizzard shuts the official servers down.
It would make sense to require a company to release the code for players to host their own servers, which has been done by many games in the past. Not to continue to run it themselves.
That counts as “working state”, assuming the published code is reasonable to operate (it must be FOSS, or at least permit open modification and distribution; and it must run in a server with specs that’s reasonable to have at the time of game publication)
The year is 2067, i have to learn compatibility programming for Applesoft’s newest OS so players can still play Spiderman Model I Ripped Online and Put Into Unreal Engines Third Person Platformer Demo
The one from Accursed Farms that set off this entire campaign. It’s not about supporting a game forever. It’s about not killing them intentionally when support ends.
I dont see any mention of them or video here, theres a petition with text here that definitely reads as supporting games indefinitely, even criticizing servers shutting down.
What part of that petition says that it’s to support games indefinitely? It explicitly requests action to protect customers after support ends. That inherently means it won’t be supported indefinitely.
I haven’t checked it out yet, but I saw someone had made a Lumines demake for the gba. Usually I end up finding out about them through forums and youtube
Bought the game when it came out was around 12 y/o, and was so happy since my parents rarely got me games. Got home, told them I needed a card for online monthly payments… The game just sat there and picked up dust. Never got to play it.
I got my copy free when I bought my PS2 hard drive and never played it once.
I lost my best friend to that game. He got into playing it so much after high school that he basically stopped doing anything else. I’d call him to hang out and he’d ghost me to play the game instead. Eventually I gave up trying…
My friends now want me to get into FFXIV and I absolutely refuse.
Username checks out, though I’m assuming you meant “demakes”?
Anyways, the demake I’m most familiar with is the in-progress Lego island. The YouTuber behind it documented part of the process in vlogs (linked on the GitHub page), so that might be an interesting starting point.
I hate to be nitpicky; but that’s a decompilation, not a demake.
‘Demake’ usually refers to a game that gets remade for a system older (or less powerful) than the one it was released for. A good current example is the in-progress Super Mario 64 demake for GBA.
‘Decompilation’ is where one reverse-engineers a game (or any software!) back to its original source code, or close enough that when you build it, it’s identical to an original copy. So, the goal of the Lego Island demake is to produce source code that can be built into a fully binary-compatible copy of Lego Island, indistinct from what’s on the original CD.
Oh I don’t mind the nitpicking, thanks for the explanation! I (apparently erroneously) thought “demake” and “decompile” were synonyms. Guess I’m one of today’s 10000.
In that case the (now taken down, but forked a gazillion times) portal64 project would be a correct example of a demake, right?
I’ve played all of the mainline games over the years, but my only experience with FFXI was a couple of hours of the beta. Tried the marathon as a set of replays several years back and only made it to the start of IX. The load times and the glacial pace of the battles was too much by that point. I think I was planning on skipping XI.
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