This whole thing has blown up completely unnecessarily. Guys, it’s a SINGLE player game! Everyone one of these things can be easily unlocked in game. If you are against it, here is a crazy idea; Don’t buy them.
The game is awesome, for anyone not blindly joining in on the circlejerk.
Whales buy it. For every 1,000 fans upset by this decision there is 1 fan who is rich enough that spending $1,000 on the game is nothing. A lot of these aggressive monetization schemes aren’t meant to make money on the average player.
The sad part is, those preyed upon aren't always necessarily well off enough to afford it.
It's one of those situations where either the microtransactions are in fact small, so the low costs add up over time before the victims realize it, or they're set up to pressure people into multiple rapid transactions, and so they either exploit some people's poor impulse control or gambling addictions, or more often than not, both.
It’s not that this monetization isn’t meant to target the average player specifically, it’s made to entice singular one-time purchases in a similar fashion to how places like Walmart work. Yes, they have the data that shows a few whales will make those transactions worth it, at the same time they are counting on catching the occasional non-whale slacking. Trick enough minnows into a net and you have the same mass as a whale.
I know this is a small difference in context, to a business it can mean millions of additional dollars. So remember: They know whales will pay. At the same time they are expecting to catch more than a few smaller fish in the process.
Yes, they have the data that shows a few whales will make those transactions worth it, at the same time they are counting on catching the occasional non-whale slacking. Trick enough minnows into a net and you have the same mass as a whale.
You’re actually thinking much more intelligently than they do. I was in games for almost two decades, left a couple years ago. The vast, vast, vast, vast majority of money made is from whales, it’s not even close. I’ve worked on games where we had to speak to banks in both Canada and the UAE to allow a man to make six figure purchases per week. He and one other whale were over 75% of our revenue.
Now the intelligent thing to do to make money here would be, as you said, getting minnows to spend – but that takes too long and the people who run these things want it now.
So rather than selling each armour colour or whatever for 50 cents each, they’ll charge 20 bucks for all of it, pricing out 90% of users*, and barely making money on it, instead of a million people buying it making them a tonne of money. (*this is a personal experience tale, this did happen, these numbers are unaltered.)
I was under the assumption this was the case for the mobile market. I didn’t realize this extended to larger titles. I mean, I guessed everyone is whale hunting, just didn’t realize to what extent. I appreciate the perspective!
To be 100% fair here, that anecdote I used was a mobile game, but the same thing does happen in larger PC/Console game titles, it’s just not 75% of (player) paid revenue.
This is especially so in games that have battlepasses – far fewer people buy those every time thank you’d think, and the ones who do are a small percentage of total players, but make up a lions share of the total revenue earned from said battlepass. Those are also the people (the every pass ones) who buy everything in the shop. 50 dollar cape or whatever, they buy it on release.
Exactly. They also have to know the number of “whales” is rapidly shrinking as more and more money is moved to fewer and fewer hands. Eventually they’ll be left with like 4-5 whales and only a couple live minnows.
Wtf is the point of anti-cheat in a single player game? Fuck Capcom, not buying anything they put out anymore. Been wanting to play Dragons Dogma 1, since I already own it, but now I don’t even want to give them the player stat.
Why are you guys pre-ordering. That behavior enables this type of greed. Promise me you won’t pre-order a game ever again, okay? I don’t care how cool that cheap plastic toy and paper map stuffed in a tin can looks. No more!
Holy shit, I read some of the other day that there was a bunch of garbage microtransactions but I had no idea it was this bad. And you can’t edit your characters without paying $2? What the fuck?
that has been a thing since monster hunter world tbh, if people are only finding about this now, they havent been playing capcom games with custom characters in the past decade.
It’s been a complaint every time, too. If people are only finding out about these disagreements now, they haven’t been discussing Capcom custom characters with people for the last decade.
This misinfo is so widespread it hurts my brain. You can edit your character easily by buying an item in game for a negligible amount of gold. A currency which is easily obtained. Same for all the other mtx offers. Stop spreading falsehoods.
Ofcourse, that being overlooked is completely stupid. Same goes for the horrible performance. Something which should’ve been there from the start. Those are legit complaints. Spreading misinfo about mtx is not part of that now is it?
That’s been a part of the game design since the first one was released over a decade ago. This is literally more than ten year old news people are getting riled up about for some reason.
In all honesty, this might be the end of Dragons Dogma if they don’t turn it around. The first game was a commercial flop even if it is a cult classic now, the MMO crashed and burned and now they ruined a good sequel for no reason.
I just don’t see how execs will greenlight another one if this isn’t a success.
The game will likely be a moderate success provided they can fix the performance problems.
Most players (unfortunately) do not care about having microtransactions in a full priced video games or about things like Denuvo. This is party the reason why the triple-a game industry is in such sorry state at the moment.
Also I find it funny that you’re already worrying about sequels when the newest game has not been out for even a day.
I know it’s weird to think about sequels already but this was a franchise that everyone thought was dead for years only to get a second chance and flush it down the toilet at the finish line.
I love the first one, janky stuff but mostly great, so when i heard this game is being made, i was ecstatic about it until i learned the game is $70 with no localised price, at that moment i’m guessing the greedy capcom is really back, because their game used to be fairly priced up until MHW. And then this happened.
How to turn a “must-play game” into trash no one wants in less than 24 hours. Good job. Makes me feel sorry for the poor devs who poured their hearts & souls into it only to have the suits fuck it up - again.
It sucks because I was looking forward to the game since I liked the first DD but after seeing all the micro transactions they added into a single player game I’m going to pass on it.
It seems your profile is stored locally from what I’ve seen, but some users are too stupid to know how to use Steam Cloud. Some users have said you can’t delete your save, but you can you just need to disable cloud backup on Steam first.
(I have no experience. I just read a lot of reviews in disappointment last night.)
Edit: Come on guys. Stop just downvoting stuff because you don’t like that it’s not as bad as it could be. Your save is stored locally, backed up on Steam Cloud. Prove me wrong if you want to downvote. That’s fine. If you’re just downvoting because you’d rather not know the reality of the situation, what’s wrong with you?
Citation? I haven’t seen this at all, and I’ve been looking at quite a bit of the stuff as a fan of the first game. That’s a big accusation to make.
People often don’t understand what they’re doing, and they blame it on things that aren’t true. Most players aren’t technologically literate enough to really know what’s causing their issues. This is the first I’ve heard of a ban, and I would suspect (though this could equally be wrong) that it isn’t because they deleted their save file and instead for doing something else, if it happened at all.
Denuvo detects manual file changes and if you do it too much (which doesn’t have to be that much) you get temporary locked out of playing the game (24h first offense). Look it up, this is the case on pretty much all recent denuvo games. This isn’t a “big accusation”, this is a straight fact. Using different proton versions also can get you “banned”.
I tried looking it up, which is why I asked for the citation. I found nothing on the topic. I don’t know where you got it from, but “look it up” isn’t an answer. Also, the save file location should be (no knowledge on whether it is) excluded from this file manipulation detection. The game itself is constantly writting to it. If it’s detecting frequent file changes, it’d detect the game itself writting to the save file.
Whose citation do you need? This is a closed-source software, there is no “proof” but only testimonies. Only EMPRESS could tell us for certain. This is one such testimony
This can also be triggered by changes in the machine itself. On linux/steamdeck, changing proton version too often leads to a 24h lock, that one you can google, it’s all over the place. Proton/wine mirrors your own PC specs, so denuvo doesnt base itself one your actual PC, but it’s configuration somehow.
As for the last part of your comment, it makes no sense. For all we know, it’s very likely that Denuvo saves a checksum of its files to their server when you exit that save or the game and checks them back when you open it again. The only way to prevent this and modify the save without the game knowing would be to make a kernel module to edit the save directly in memory while the save is running, though depending on how denuvo works, something like cheat engine might also do the trick.
The person said people have been banned for deleting their save files. I haven’t seen any reference for this. What you posted is for a totally different game and is not related except both have Denuvo. I don’t doubt Denuvo anti-cheat (maybe also anti-tamper) will ban you for doing things it doesn’t like, but deleting save files shouldn’t, and I haven’t ever heard of that happening.
As for the last part of your comment, it makes no sense. For all we know, it’s very likely that Denuvo saves a checksum of its files to their server when you exit that save or the game and checks them back when you open it again. The only way to prevent this and modify the save without the game knowing would be to make a kernel module to edit the save directly in memory while the save is running, though depending on how denuvo works, something like cheat engine might also do the trick.
Checksums for the game files do not include the save folder. That would defeat the purpose of a checksum. Sure, maybe they fucked up and included it, but that would cause it to go off every time the game saves as well. Every file change changes the sum, so even the game doing so would also. How would it know the difference?
Again, I don’t like Denuvo. I think a lot of stuff happening with this game is bad. We don’t need to make stuff up though. There’s plenty actually there to be angry about. Making stuff up just makes the valid complaints get lumped with it and ignored.
I’m not talking about one checksum that’s hardcoded somewhere, I mean they calculate it every time you close the save. Do they actually do that, I don’t know, but they could if they wanted to.
The reason why I linked some random other game is because nobody is saying this is the game’s fault, but Denuvo’s fault. Denuvo behaves extremely similarly regardless of the game it runs on, so if it happens for most other games, good chance it happens for this one too.
I’m not talking about one checksum that’s hardcoded somewhere, I mean they calculate it every time you close the save. Do they actually do that, I don’t know, but they could if they wanted to.
They could do anything, and anyone can claim they are doing things without evidence. I have seen nothing except this person’s comment that it’s happening, and even what you posted has nothing to do with save files. I don’t believe such a thing is happening because I haven’t seen any evidence for it and have seen many people discuss deleting their saves. A claim like that needs evidence. It’s going to make people fearful of deleting saves.
Why did you come do defend this person’s specific claim only to say “Denuvo bad.” We all already know that. We don’t need to make shit up about it. Please stop. Criticize what we actually know is happening with the game. There’s plenty.
Once again, these are secondary sources at best. “people are saying that they heard somewhere that…” Are these using the same secondary source? I don’t know. I haven’t seen any evidence that it happens with save files.
The second third (didn’t realize it was 3) link also mentions switching Proton versions too much can cause issues and uses a primary source, and I saw that review the other night while looking at reviews. That is much more trustworthy.
I’m not saying it isn’t happening, but I don’t trust what everyone says. I also don’t trust that a user actually knows what triggered an action. The number of people I’ve seen say the saves are stored online because they don’t understand Steam Cloud is proof that a lot of users aren’t technologically literate enough to just take their word. With there being no first hand source, and potentially both of what you linked using the same secondary source, I still see no reason to believe this.
So, “How many testimonies do you need to consider it “evidence” as you say?” More than 0, which is what we’re at right now.
Edit: Missed the first article when I clicked the links the first time. Even it says it can’t verify the reports and it’s just gathered from forums (and proceeds to not cite them). Any half decent journalist would verify it for themselves, but we know these aren’t journalists, they’re blogs that just repeat any drama they can find. Still only secondary sources at best with no citation, so nothing to be taken as anything more than the comment above saying “they heard it happened to someone.”
Apparently all the purchases you can buy are cheaply available in game with the in game currency, and there’s no real reason to pay real money for them unless you’re like some live streamer goob.
That’s not completely true, there is a limited number of port crystals until NG+ (around 5 or 6) and the adventurers camping kit is unobtainable otherwise (although you can get a better one from a side quest).
Ferrystones are also very rare, unlike DD1 where you get an unlimited one right away.
What I’ve heard from people playing the game, is that those and everything else you could pay real money for is dirt cheap to buy and purchasable with the in game currency that you earn by playing the game and that you earn the in game currency quickly enough that you aren’t having to grind anything if you want to buy the stuff.
I think there’s some sort of higher-up mandate at capcom to force monetized content into their games, and the dev teams are just working around it, something like that. The same thing happens in monster hunter, street fighter 6, I think devil may cry 5, and it’s all structured in basically the exact same way, where you can either get access to stuff really quickly without paying, or the stuff you have to pay for is basically just aesthetic, or both. I think monster hunter rise even tried to do the same “pay to edit your character” thing. I still don’t think it’s a good practice, but japanese devs are gonna japanese dev, I suppose. Reminds me of fromsoft titles requiring community made performance patches, or being locked to like, 30fps as an engine requirement, shit like that.
Games are supposed to be fun. Forcing paying customers to do something intentionally designed to be not fun before they can have fun is stupid. I know I’m in the minority, but I straight up won’t participate in that bullshit.
I mean…the weak start is kind of the basis of every rpg and almost every fps in existence. You start with the crappy bb gun and then somehow you end up becoming an all powerful stealth archer, even though your game doesn’t even offer a bow to use.
Gaining strength through experience is fun if it’s done in a sane way is fun. Farming the same monsters over and over to unlock common feature is not. Hit the X button 4.5 million times to continue is shit.
It’s not an accident that unlocking this stuff is tedious when there’s an option to just pay more money to do so. That’s the value proposition behind microtransactions in games: Give us money or we’ll force you to do boring shit for many hours.
Man. It sure sucks I only start with a water can and 500 coins in Stardew Valley. I could do so much more if I could just start with 20 upgraded sprinklers and 20,000 coins.
The worst part of it is that those same assholes that insisted on micro transactions will blame every other aspect of the game before admitting that it did poorly on release because of the blatant money grabbing.
Yup, I’ll wait 4 years or whatever until it’s released as “Dragon’s dogma 2, darker arisen, game of the year edition” with all the dlc and microtransactions baked in on a steam sale or some such
I’m pretty mixed on this. I want to support niche games like this being made. I don’t want to support using Denuvo (even if it’ll be removed eventually) or bad MTX. Also, you’ll miss the online components on a cracked version, which is really cool in DS1 at least and I think even better in 2 from what I’ve heard.
The thing to me is, I don’t want the online experiences in most of my single player games. I turned off invasions and messages in DS. I could care less about someone else’s experience bleeding into mine, most invasions were annoying and messages were memes. For DD, let me build my pawn, pick from some randomly generated ones and that’s it, don’t punish me for wanting to single-play my single-player game. I don’t mind DLC that is purely a time saver, some people want to pay to win, in a single player game that’s fine, as long as it’s not replacing some stupidly long grind. But at the end of the day, there are far too many “single player” games that are “connect to our server to use the thing you just bought.”
You can play this offline I’m 99% sure. Sure, it’s best enjoyed online (the online experience is seemless and you don’t actually interact with other players, just the pawns they created), but it’s purely optional.
This game is getting so much hate for made up reasons and it’s really frustrating. I would love for the actual reasons to be addressed, but if they see that 99% of it isn’t stuff that’s there anyway, why would they bother fixing the 1% when it’ll just get lied about no matter what?
You can, after you get through a bit of a process of making your pawn and uploading it. I agree it’s being reviewbombed, my response was to yours about claiming that “you’re missing out if you don’t play online.” But also, you’re talking about a company that pulls hundreds of millions of dollars a year, not an indie developer. If the game sells well, the reviews don’t mean anything, it’s successful. If it doesn’t, it’s their job to focus on what consumers didn’t like and change it.
If the game sells well, the reviews don’t mean anything, it’s successful. If it doesn’t, it’s their job to focus on what consumers didn’t like and change it.
Ideally, yes. However, it’s taken 12 years for a second entry of this franchise. If it doesn’t do well (which I think we’re well past it not doing well, because it’s selling great), most likely they’d just never make a game like it again. The first game is a cult classic. It released about a year after Dark Souls 1 and scratch the same itch before anyone else was making Souls-likes. It didn’t do huge numbers though despite being received fairly well. The fact they made a second is unexpected, and we’d certainly not get a third if it only did as well as the first. They wouldn’t learn a lesson except not to touch this. The same MTX methods are in RE and no one comained, so they aren’t going to learn the lesson we want for just this one game.
It’s going to make them boatloads of money, the review bombs won’t matter. They’ve broken 200k concurrent players on steam, it’s a financial success. Of course they won’t make another like it again, neither will almost any AAA developer. The market is gearing towards games as a service, forced online/multiplayer and some such, except for the few household names continuing to support single player titles. This was a planned business decision to cash in on a franchise that was calculated as a perfect time to release a sequel, and put in the work to capture the longtime fans, and it’s making money. I’m happy for it, but Capcom is a corporation, they ran financial models and test groups to see if the game would sell well, it has, and so it’s successful.
its what japanese game companies do after a “golden era” when they come off on top. they make stupid business decisions that tank their goodwill they just earned.
its why when a japanese game company makes it big, it almost always is followed with becoming the villian immediately after
the sucess of monster hunter, resident evil remakes, and sf6 has gotten to their head.
Honestly, I might get shit for this and he was definitely an asshole, but Phil Fish was right. The Japanese game industry went through a shitty period for awhile years ago, got out of it, and then now (Capcom anyway) starts doing shit like this.
Sony became very aggressive and anti consumer the moment the PS4 outsold the Xbox One after being behind the shadow of the 360 for most of its life. started paying for a lot of timed exclusives, exclusive game content (e.g COD, Hogwarts Legacy), block a lot of cross platform attempts.
Nintendo went very anti consumer after being very generous with the WiiU, and resurrecting the 3DS and releasing the sucessful, but very feature limited Switch. introduces paid online for an online service thats effectively at times, worse than the WiiU, decides to sell emulated titles either on limited time offer (Mario 3d collection) or required subscription to online, and take away browser and local save backups.
i could keep going on with a lot of sucessful japanese game companies, but its basically the same story every fucking time.
They were thinking, “Look at what customers constantly put up with from Blizzard and Ubisoft. Our core gameplay is fun and people have FOMO, so let’s be similarly shitty.”
The goal should be fast travel people don’t want to use because travel is fun.
The Spiderman games for the most part made moving around the city fun enough that I didn’t fast travel, but it was still there for the times I had to go really far away.
If you need a feature that lets players skip a part of your game, you should either make that part better or just remove it. But you should still make concessions to players who want to skip it anyway. Like the little “skip cutscene” buttons.
Travel is fun, Capcom are just a dumb company. You’ll get plenty of access to fast travel tokens throughout the game, but the act is still limited to only a handful of fast travel points. Cart travel has been my preferred method of going long distances, which does come with the risk of a griffon ambush, but griffon ambushes mean you get more combat.
IMO Morrowind did fast travel best: they integrated it into the world, kept it limited (fixed origins/destinations, plus mark/recall) and gave it an appropriate cost (time, gold, magicka, and/or effort needed to discover transit locations).
The key differences are that Morrowind does not have microtransactions/paid mods, and does have the Elder Scrolls Construction set – so I’m pretty sure you could mod in a less limited fast travel mechanism if you really wanted.
Geez! I watched the first few minutes of fightincowboy review on it and he was praising it saying the best thing since Elden Ring. I’m sure the gameplay is great, but what a way to get your game reviewed bombed for good reason. I’m sure this will go on sale soon enough if they don’t make any changes. What a disappointment, micro transactions should never exist on Single Player games let alone most games. Scummy Capcom!
The fuckers already raised the price to “compete with inflation”. I might have been able to accept that by itself, but with this shit added in? It really reveals their intent.
If they haven’t played it, yes. You can’t “re-view” something you haven’t viewed in the first place.
So taking an aspect of the game and writing a review of it without actually playing it is review bombing.
I’m not saying it’s wrong to review bomb, as this deserves it. But reviews are supposed to be for those that have already consumed the product or used the service.
Like I said, I don’t think it’s wrong to review bomb. It’s just not an actual “review.” It’s certainly an expression or opinion of distaste, which is why it’s warranted, just not a review.
I already clocked a handful of hours into the game, I’ve been lucky enough not to experience any issues at all with a high ish end system. I’ve been having a blast, and the game is everything I wanted it to be, but man, it’s weird seeing the rest of the internet having a bad time with it.
Saw that someone was crashing on the first playable section of the game repeatedly and that blows to see. What really gets me is the mtx stuff, I don’t pay it any attention and Im having a great time and it hasnt been in my face one bit.
What’s really getting me down too is seeing how people are having a bad time with the game while Im having a great time but it feels like I shouldnt be. Is anyone else experiencing something similar?
That was my experience playing Cyberpunk at launch while everyone was up in arms about the performance issues. I was just quietly enjoying it and knew it was just a matter of time for the devs to resolve those problems.
I’m admittedly less patient/tolerant of microtransactions though, because they’re intentional. They’re the reason I feel like the mobile game market turned into to a cesspool.
Yeah I pretty much had this exact situation with Cyberpunk as well, maybe we are just lucky with our performance.
After reading your comment though, I feel like you’re right about the microtransactions. While it does not affect me and my enjoyment of the game, it is a bad practice which ends up bringing down the reputation of an IP I like a lot, which is bad for everyone.
Yeah, I’m in the same boat. Despite only having a laptop 3070, and not a desktop 4090 that others are seeing slowdown on, I feel like the numbers Steam is feeding me for FPS is a lie because it says I’m getting 40-50fps but it feels smoother than that for some reason. I am seeing significant slowdown in the capital but other than that I’m not getting bad performance, or bugs, and the microtransactions are easy to ignore because everything is easily obtainable. I’ve been having a blast for the most part, and when they get out some patches maybe I won’t even see slowdown in busy areas. Maybe.
The one thing that gets my goat is the one save system. For the benefit of anybody reading, there IS a way to delete your save on PC, disabling Steam Cloud sync, deleting the file, starting a new game, then turning sync back on and telling Steam to use your local files rather than your cloud files when it complains about a conflict. But the fact remains that this should be a feature within the game itself, not basically cheated in. I frequently restart games because I get distracted and go play something else, come back, can’t remember the plot. This is a major roadblock for me, though of course not one I’m encountering just yet.
I’ve got a high opinion of the devs at Capcom, as they seem to be genuinely interested in making great games.I rarely have a bad time playing a Capcom game. It’s just… The execs. And things like the microtransactions, Denuvo, and the one save system reek of stuff the execs tried to shoehorn in that the game didn’t need to try and bleed the users dry. I’m just grateful that, for the time being, these changes don’t affect me much, but you’re right, it does make me feel a little guilty to have a good time while others can’t even play it.
I haddent heard of any of this until i saw the new Mortisimal gaming video, but he didnt get specific about them. Now that i actually see this, its a pass from me for years.
Capcom continually hamstringing themselves. With this and Street Fighter 6 having 100 dollar costume sets they can fuck all the way off. I expect RE9 to let you buy ammo for cash.
I mean, the RE4make let you buy weapon upgrades with cash, DMC 5 let you just buy all the currencies in game directly, I don’t even know where to begin with Monster Hunter World’s microtransactions. It’s shitty, but Capcom does this in literally all of their games now, so absolutely you’ll see dumb mtx in RE9 and Monster Hunter Rise.
That’s almost too harsh. The one positive thing you can say on the matter is that Capcom isn’t running around shuttering development of games to lay-off developers in order to manufacture like 3 points of profit. The Western AAA games industry is fucking disgusting in their greed, the Eastern AAA industry is just kinda confusing.
Weird thing is no one went and review bombed DMC 5. It’s still talked up as being one of the best hack and slashes. Re4 was continuously talked up as game of the year. If people are going after DD2 then be fucking consistent towards other games too.
i mean havent played 2 yet, but travel in dragons dogma 1 was not fun, especially the number of times you had to cross the stone canyon path between the Cassadarris and Gran Soren got very stale.
lemmy.world
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