Real time strategy games are not my cup of tea. Nothing against anyone who enjoys them, understand, but they're basically exercises in who can do the clicky clicky faster. Give me a turn-based game any day... where you actually have to out-think versus out-click your opponents.
Oh, and any game that pits console players against PC players. Yes, let's put the 'stock controllers only' console players up against the PC players with $8,675,309.00 of custom equipment and every cheat they can get away with. Sounds like a reasonable plan. Overwatch, I'm looking at you.
In multiple posts you mentioned how you expected people on fediverse to be “more principled” and how they can only support the smaller option or just give up and accept everything corps throw at them which is why you’re surprised some play gacha games.
Does that expectation also extend to “normal” F2P games like Apex, Fortnite etc? Does it include people playing full-price AAA games? Titles like GTA, Diablo, Halo, majority of MMOs and more - games that not only are paid but also include season passes and micro transactions.
Should people also avoid those?
Just so we’re clear, it’s a genuine question. I have no skin in the game as I don’t really play HSR, AAA games or really care what people expect from me but I’m curious about your perspective on things.
I avoid those games. But I don’t expect others to have the same tastes as me. I’m certainly not demanding people don’t like those kind of games like OP seems to be doing about Honkai
Which is totally fair - I feel like most (conjecture?) people who dislike such things will simply avoid these games and play other stuff.
OP focused on gacha games but didn’t mention paid ones despite the fact many of them implement similar monetization schemes which is why I’m curious about their point of view on this.
My main problem is with F2P mobile games that have any kind of gambling mechanics associated with them, or any games that are set up to get you to pay endlessly for the privilege of playing the game, even though it’s not marketed as a subscription service game.
World of Warships, World of Tanks, and War Thunder are the big non-mobile offenders, in this regard.
Games like Fortnite and Apex are just on the acceptable side of things, because they’re mainly selling cosmetics. They’re not claiming to be free, then blocking off large sections of the game behind grind-fests, which you can then get rid of with paywalls. As far as I know, you can play all the Apex and Fortnite you want, and the only temptation to spend money is based on “oooh, I want that cool-looking thing.”
Resisting the impulse to buy a cool-looking thing is everyone’s own responsibility. Therefore, selling cool-looking things isn’t unethical. Getting someone addicted to gambling and/or using Skinnerian conditioning to slowly acclimatize them to paying for a “free” game is NOT okay.
Alright, that cleared up some things, thanks. I assume FIFA’s (well, EA’s FC) Ultimate Team also falls under that umbrella since it’s straight up rolling for power?
Since you’re fine with cosmetics what about mobile/gacha games that are primarily that?
For example, I play a game called Girls Frontline - I didn’t pay anything yet have all bar 3 characters (the missing ones can be farmed on stages I haven’t played yet) with most of them leveled up and equipped for pretty much any available content. There’s no stamina that needs to be refilled and events have 3 difficulty levels to allow even new(ish) players to complete the story. The main monetary incentive here comes from skins (which can also be obtained using saved up resources). Would a game like this be alright according to your perspective?
While majority of gacha can absolutely be predatory there are more titles like that within the “genre” which is why I’m interested in your focus on mobile titles. Sorry if it sounds like I’m trying to look for a “gotcha” or something like that - that’s not my intention.
The Girls Frontline game seems to occupy basically the same space as Fortnite, from what you’re saying. Also, I really appreciate the fact that you’re questioning my position in a constructive way, unlike a lot of the people here, who basically jumped at me, automatically taking a de facto position of defending all gacha games, no matter how predatory.
Being asked these questions in a constructive manner isn’t just more polite, it IS actually constructive. It’s helping me to refine and understand my own position. I strive to be consistent and logic-driven, in my opinions, but nobody’s perfect. I can admit that some of my views may be somewhat emotion-based, and can be specified and sharpened based on discussion.
I think the most important thing to avoid, if you don’t want to be playing a game that’s unethical (and maybe even dangerous) is anything that combines a stamina refilling, gameplay limiting mechanic AND a pay-to-roll gacha mechanic. The worst of those being the kind where the common characters (or weapons, mechs, cars, etc) are super-duper weak, compared to the rare and overpowered characters.
Either one of those mechanics can be bad, especially if it’s tied to spending money. Combining them together is extra bad. It’s even worse if the game continually markets itself as “free.”
If a game has no stamina-based playtime-limiting mechanic AND the unlockable characters/skins are entirely (or almost entirely) cosmetic, I figure it’s basically fine.
I’m glad I could give you a chance to expand on your view in a more neutral manner. I like discussing things and learning other people’s points of view so I try to approach online discussion in a positive and open-minded way. It’s not always easy but I try.
I think the main reason people jumped on you so easily was the tone of your OP and some of the more heated comments - they come off like you aren’t really interested in an explanation but rather looking for affirmation in shit talking other people’s interest in those games. Feeling strongly about a topic can be a detriment at times and it’s an easy way to derail a decent topic for a conversation.
That said, seems like we’re pretty much on the same page even if I don’t feel as strongly towards the disliked parts of the industry as you do. I simply stick to titles that don’t punish me for not spending ever increasing amounts of money.
In the vein of multiplayer games with singleplay bot matches like Battlefield 1942 being mentioned, try the standalone mod for for Battlefield 2 called Forgotten Hope 2. Many maps have single player bot support (by launching coop server on your lan). Battlgroup 42 mod for bf1942 has a tons of singleplayer maps too. You can also get bots via third party plugins for the og Day of Defeat (sturmbot or shrikebot) and as mentioned Day of Infamy has built-in bot support. Worth mentioning are the Arma 3 WW2 mods and dlc.
I played the Witness for… maybe 5 hours? when it came out. A friend got all the beacons and it took forever! I was amazed at how much variation this game had in its puzzles.
I should really pick it up again, maybe I’ll get my partner to try it. Is it on ps5?
I can't comment on this title in particular but if you load it on your PS5 and receive a toast which reads something to the effect of "when playing on PS5, this game may exhibit errors or unexpected behavior" then it means some part of the game is absolutely fucked up but still "playable."
For example, Star Ocean: Till the End of Time messes up very late in to the game on the PS5 where a space ship environment zooms very far out, the controls become locked in such a way where camera control doesn't work, and directional movement controls seem arbitrarily mapped. While someone more patient and talented than I may have been able to navigate through that issue, I couldn't proceed until I continued the game on my PS4 via cloud save transfer.
waaaay out of the timeframe you have specified (it is a 2020 game that is still actively updated) but still with the same vibes, I'd check out Easy Red 2, as it scratches that specific itch of a WW2 shooter with scale. It is maybe too open at times for my taste but it is one of the very few modern games covering that niche. It does have optional squad management gameplay elements but you can ignore those in favor of playing a simple soldier, and the AI will do those jobs for you. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7ziR73NhHjY
Andor’s Trail is a foss roguelike with a twist that it’s story based, something quite rare in this genre.
Immortal Life is a farming game but with a Wuxia twist where you can use chinese magic to help you do your chores and there’s a twin stick combat inside the dungeon. What surprised me was seeing the game selling well on steam, but never seeing a single article about it, strangely common with chinese indies over here.
I would imagine that most articles about Chinese Indie Games are written in Mandarin, so it’s unlikely you’d see them without the ability to read Chinese.
There’s nothing to discuss based on your viewpoint. It doesn’t matter what anyone says about the gameplay being actually OK because you’ve already formed your opinion it seems. Judging a book by its cover.
I’m not judging a book by its cover. I’m just calling a spade a spade. Predatory F2P mobile games are not okay. Ever.
I mean, look at where we are. We’re on Lemmy. We all fled Reddit, because we found their policies about advertising and, like, moderator politics to be unacceptable. But now you’re going to stan for fucking mobile gacha game companies?
Since we’re talking about it now, I do actually dare you to explain that position to me. How is that not, like, spectacularly hypocritical?
Have you played the game? What about it is predatory? It never forced me to pay for anything and I was able to complete the story without spending a dime.
I’m not stanning anything. Just being part of the, discussion, if you can call it that.
It just sounds like you’re judging it solely based on the fact there are a few buzzwords in the game and you’re not forming an actual opinion of your own.
Please address my point about Reddit. How is it not hypocritical to leave Reddit and come here, to the fringes of the internet, based on moral principles…but then go ahead and support and defend mobile F2P gacha game villains?
I “fled Reddit” because they started making really stupid managerial decisions and screwing over the user base. They changed how they do things, and I no longer agreed to it. The same thing happened to me on Lemmy. I initially joined a server that decided that majority vote was the way to run things, and I left. Then I joined a server that died. I finally found my current one and like it.
Though in reality, I now frequent both sites and enjoy them for different reasons.
Gacha games, though… They tell you up front what to expect, and they do that. (Except certain illegal cases that actually got in legal trouble for it.) Yes, they’re predatory and manipulative, and they ruin the lives of some people who have certain tendencies. That really sucks.
But they’re fun and satisfy an urge that many people have that isn’t getting satisfied otherwise.
I think spending hundreds of dollars on a game is stupid (I’ve done it, over a couple years on 1 game) and I think spending thousands is insane, even if you have more money than you can ever use. But I can and do play them for free (or close to it) now if they are fun and don’t waste my time.
I don’t think these positions are hypocritical. I’m not on Lemmy because I’m a zealot. I’m on here because I enjoy it.
That’s actually a very fair set of arguments, if you’re absolutely and scrupulously telling the truth.
I kind of suspect that you would have described your position as much more of an “I’m doing the morally upstanding thing,” when you initially left reddit…but I can’t prove that.
I also can’t personally agree that “we’re up front and open about being predatory douchenozzles” is somehow a get-out-of-jail-free-card for gacha racketeers. But I’ll concede your position is not as directly hypocritical as I thought.
Griftlands doesn’t get as much attention as I think it deserves. It’s everything Slay the Spire offers, but better. With plot and characters and two decks to balance.
I bought it discounted because i remember that i have seen it before. I really did not expect it to be this good. The world, the storyline and the combat are just awesome. Highly recommended!
The PS4 allowed people to choose between frame rate and graphical prowess. The PS4 Pro basically eliminated the necessity to choose. We’re seeing games on PS5 that give you similar options, so I assume a PS5 Pro will also render those preferences unnecessary.
Is having ray tracing at 60FPS important enough for you to wait? Furthermore, do you have patience if PS5 pros are hard to come by for the first 3-6 months of availability?
Phoenotopia: Awakening – an amazing metroidvania-related game. Relatively more popular than the other games I list, but is honestly one of my favorite games of all time.
Vision: Soft Reset – a metroidvania, but you can travel backwards and forwards in time and this really matters for gameplay.
Bombe – Minesweeper, but instead of solving the puzzles manually, you create rules (“if there is a cell with the number N and there are N empty cells around it, mark them all as mines”) which the game applies automatically.
SOLAS 128 – a puzzle game where you redirect signals in a huge machine, just a great experience if you like puzzle games.
I fucking HATE Souls-like games. I love fantasy and RPG games but FromSoft games are just hard for the sake of being hard.
I’m an adult with a life (kinda) - I don’t have 600hrs to dedicate to defeating the fucking Taurus Demon. I even looked up HOW to kill it but apparently my controller usage wasn’t good enough to move at speed even though I completed God of War 3 on the highest difficulty.
The fact I had to re-tread the same stupid fucking area before that to reach the fucking Taurus Cunt was to much.
I quit the game and vowed to never play another FromSoft game or anything that claimed to be a “Souls-like”.
I stupidly listened to someone say Sekiro was a better game than Ghost of Tsushima (which I love). So I played it…
WTF?! The first group of enemies were all identical - no variations. There was also only TWO fucking moves I could perform. A wooden-looking block and a janky looking attack. An absolute fucking abortion of a game and I’m convinced the idiot who told me it was better than GoT had never played it.
My first “souls-like” was Dark Souls on the Xbox 360. I had never even heard of the game, knew nothing about it, and played completely blind, never googled anything. I finished the game in about 40 hours. It was the best game I’d played in years.
I kind of just give up at the Capricorn demon each time I try, it’d be fine if it was one on one, but the dogs prevent you from being able to properly fight it
I bought dark souls on the recommendation of a friend. I ended up returning it the next day. Life is difficult enough. I’ll never understand why some people like to feed frustration for fun.
Dota and League of Legends. The moba format simply doesn’t click with me. Them being hyper competitive doesn’t help, and I’m someone who played plenty of UT2004 during my late teens
It will be if they give it some TLC like CD PROJEKT and Hello did with their games. There’s a lot to like about Starfield, but it has problems that have a big impact on gameplay. I don’t want to deal with that inventory system for the hours it will take for me to enjoy the story. In general, the menus kinda suck. They really need to work on the ergonomics.
Bethesda never does that and from what I’ve heard the modding community still won’t switch away from Skyrim. They, too, are tired of Bethesda’s shit and they already invested so much time in Skyrim to fix it up they might just as well continue.
The problem with starfield is not technical but that the writing is pretty crappy in general. Technical or feature problems can be fixed (cyberpunk or no man’s sky did it) but the story can’t be extensively rewritten without making it a different game.
Is the story that bad? I played a few hours and I was into it. Does it get worse later? I set the game aside because it was buggy and didn’t exactly run well. I’m planning to pick it up again after it gets some updates.
In the 6 or so hours I played, it was the inventory and menus that drove me crazy more than anything else. They are so poorly designed and implemented that I wonder if anyone actually played the game during testing. I can’t see myself continuing the game until they are improved.
It’s the kind of thing that the more you think about it the more flaws you find. The stories from the different factions also feel very disconnected, like Skyrim’s. Everything seems to exist in a vacuum).
But don’t take me for my word, if you already have it play the game and see if you enjoy it, that’s what’s important.
Liked the main story well enough. Not as good as Morrowind but on par with FO3/4 and Skyrim which I grade as mediocre. Starfield does have some of my most enjoyed faction quests though.
Biggest failings to me were the repetitive POIs and half finished sub systems that while functional could have been so much better. I’m still happy with my purchase and see myself playing again over the coming years but it’s understandable why so many people walked away from it.
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Aktywne