bin.pol.social

Fabian, do games w I am working on a turn-based wargame, influenced by the old Win3.x era WinWar 2 game

I personally enjoy grand strategy games. But seeing a game about an ongoing war is somewhat strange

Lembot_0004,

Ongoing war? Nah, that is an absolutely typically boring WW2-themed game.

magikmw, do gaming w I'm still in full denial, personally.

Honestly, going 27 years (of gaming), and I never was smarter and quicker to make tactical decisions. My hand may move slower, but I don't rely on dexterity when flanking your cover.

And other gaming skills, only better.

philpo, do games w Krafton Issue Statement Regarding Subnautica 2

There is also the possibility,like always, that both sides are assholes, btw.

RaivoKulli, do gaming w I'm still in full denial, personally.

Tomas Jerby

electric, do games w I am working on a turn-based wargame, influenced by the old Win3.x era WinWar 2 game

Not my cup of tea but pretty cool. And nice thinking with using SVGs for scaling.

Lembot_0004,

Just some fun information: most modern engines hate SVG. They just render them to the raster and then manipulate them like any other bitmap, making everything extremely slow and blurry. If that is mostly ok with small pictogram-tier images, it is completely unacceptable for big map-tier images. My map is tens thousand of pixels in size while at the highest scale. Bitmap would be a few TiB of RAM. So I actually parse the SVG to get the vectors and draw them, omitting the rasterization.

JustARaccoon,

Does that lead to any performance hiccups with very detailed svgs? The benefit of raster is you can mipmap them, so you don’t need to see how super detailed the coast of a country is like when it’s only a few pixels on screen. I suppose you could fake mipmaps by having different levels of detail for svgs that get swapped between, as long as any other changes you make to the svg are simple colour changes?

Lembot_0004,

It might. But I can’t imagine how detailed should SVG be to be more problematic than bitmap during rescale.

JustARaccoon,

Well, say, country-size :D

afaix,

So are you basically making a more modern flash game? I think all flash graphics were vector and that gave them a really cool look

glitchdx, do gaming w I'm still in full denial, personally.

I’m in this picture and I don’t like it.

Chill_Dan, do games w Pop it in your calendars

Avast ye matey!

TrojanRoomCoffeePot,
@TrojanRoomCoffeePot@lemmy.world avatar
DoucheBagMcSwag, (edited ) do gaming w I'm still in full denial, personally.

MFW: you have given up PvP in favor of single player and PvE games as that live service treadmill and toxicity are too much now

ameancow,

I don’t care about toxic players and I never spend a dime on any live services… my chief issue is that I have to work for a living and online game matchmaking mix me with people (children) who’s primary stressor in life is trying to print out homework that doesn’t look like ChatGTP wrote it.

otp,

skill issue

Mustakrakish,

For me its more of a return to the fold.

samus12345,
@samus12345@sh.itjust.works avatar

I just never did PvP in the first place.

TabbsTheBat, do games w Pop it in your calendars
@TabbsTheBat@pawb.social avatar

It’s a canon event for any game company that achieves moderate success

daniskarma,

Kerbal Space Program 2 still hurts me.

nuko147,
@nuko147@lemmy.world avatar

Although Kerbal space program 2 had major issues from the dev team, only for the publisher to pull the plug because of how bad the progress was, and leave the game in permanent early access.

sp3ctr4l,

Uh, its more like a new publisher bought the IP, functionally fired almost all of the original dev team, and then hired a bunch of other people who had no idea how their insanely modified version of Unity worked…

And then the idiot in charge just started spamming out extremely grand and difficult to implement new core functionalities… with a team of mostly newbies who had no idea how anything worked.

So, basically, they started out where KSP started out… and would very obviously thus need years and years and years to get it out of Early Access / Alpha state… but it needed to make money NOW, and it didn’t, so everyone got laid off (other than the idiot in charge), and the game was functionally abandoned, but not totally abandoned, because MY IP MINE NO YOU CANT HAVE IT!!!

Or… maybe not? With regard to the IP rights?

Nobody seems to know who actually owns the KSP IP at this point.

techdriveplay.com/…/kerbal-space-program-2-a-tale…

ByteJunk,
@ByteJunk@lemmy.world avatar

I never understood the fixation on IPs. For a kick ass universe with amazing lore etc, ok sure.

I mean I love Jeb and the gang as much as the next guy, but they’re not core to my enjoyment of KSP1. The mechanics were.

sp3ctr4l,

lol, RIP Jebs 1 - 48395.

But uh yeah, the… the lore is basically:

We made some cute little dudes and dudettes that are… possibly animated, sapient fungi? Or something?

Anyway they are sm0l and live in sm0l solar system.

And they have a space program.

And most of the characters are just obvious cutesy knock offs of famous humans in spaceflight.

Woo!

lol

AwesomeLowlander,

Name recognition sells stuff. Somebody who loved KSP 1 will probably give KSP 3 a go, at least to a greater probability than an unrelated game in the same genre.

sp3ctr4l,

Dean Hall and RocketWorkz of uh DayZ fame/infamy… are working on Kitten Space Agency… I dunno, maybe they could pull it off?

Dean’s track record is really hit and miss imo, but hey, at least they actually give a damn and try, often with pretty bold / niche concepts.

AwesomeLowlander,

Hopefully! My comment wasn’t aimed at KSP / KSA though, just talking about why IP is valuable

cynar,

It was even worse than that.

They were basically given the KSP1 codebase and told to rewrite it to be better. However, KSP1 was still being developed, and they didn’t want to demotivate the KSP1 team. Therefore they were banned from even telling them it existed, let alone ask for help or advice with the existing codebase.

EldritchFeminity,

One of the original goals for KSP2 was the use of a new engine to get rid of the technical debt from the first game that caused issues like the Kraken…but then the publisher forced them to use the KSP engine because “it would speed up development.”

It was doomed from the beginning.

sp3ctr4l,

Yep.

Having worked in software dev and db management professionally, and having been modding (as in making mods) all kinds of games for even longer… yep, I knew it was completely fucked almost immedeately, as soon as it was:

Throw out most of the old dev team

We are gonna rebuild the engine/game from the ground up

Add in vastly complex features and capabilities at the same time

On a horrendously unrealistic timeframe.

Normally, any two of those is extreme danger zone.

Cornelius_Wangenheim,

Hopefully Kitten Space Agency ends up being a true spiritual sequel.

pennomi,

Except ConcernedApe, apparently.

TabbsTheBat,
@TabbsTheBat@pawb.social avatar

Individual devs seem to generally manage better I think :3. It’s once the companies expand is that stuff starts going awry

brucethemoose, (edited )

Coffee Stain’s another good example on the bigger end.

It does seem like there’s a danger zone behind a certain size threshold. It makes me worry for Warhorse (the KCD2 dev), which plans to expand beyond 250.

wolframhydroxide,

I dunno, dwarf fortress seems to be doing alright for itself so far. Tarn and Zach really needed some more help and some graphic design backup. I don’t agree with the total abandonment of the keybindings system in favor of mouse clicks, but I understand that it was necessary to make the game’s learning curve less precipitous.

pory,
@pory@lemmy.world avatar

Didn’t sell out to a company or publisher with shareholder profit motives. Truly independent (not “indie” as slang for low budget) development teams don’t follow this pattern unless they sell their IP and studio outright.

RizzRustbolt,

Or the Terraria team.

kautau,

It’s a canon event for any game company that achieves moderate success gets acquired by investors

Very much not exclusive to the game industry

TabbsTheBat,
@TabbsTheBat@pawb.social avatar

True :3

I just said game to stay on topic tbh

kautau,

Makes sense, wasn’t untrue and I wasn’t criticizing, just wanted to make sure everyone remembers that the problem goes up the chain due to capitalism.

Various companies/games were mentioned in the comments, but I think a good example is Hello Games. Clearly fumbled their game launch and were over ambitious with No Man’s Sky.

But it’s gotten an incredible amount of things that were promised, and many things that weren’t, all as free updates. Sure, they’re still making money, that’s the point, but instead of Micro-transactions, overpriced DLC, fucking over the devs, shutting things down, they just keep rolling. I’m sure they’ve gotten offers of acquisition that were probably very lucrative, but they didn’t take them, and have continued their slow roll of making gamers happy.

shialac,

Rip ZA/UM

Duamerthrax,

I think Croteam has been able to have moderate success over the years, but being based in Eastern Europe might make them insulated from issues. Devolver only recently bought them, but they seem to be one of the few good publishers. I at least didn’t see their name on the Video Games Europe member list that’s opposed to SKGs.

burntbacon,

It would make sense for it to be canon in the subnautica universe. I think they were pretty much the epitome of authors with an anvil with the references to economics and governing.

samus12345, do gaming w I'm still in full denial, personally.
@samus12345@sh.itjust.works avatar

I cut my teeth on games when being balls hard was the standard. I paid my dues. Nowadays I just put them on easy (and use save states for old games).

merc, do games w Pop it in your calendars
@merc@sh.itjust.works avatar

Pop it in your calendars? Maybe I’m using calendars wrong, but mine aren’t filled with things I should avoid doing. But, I’m willing to learn. What date should I put “Don’t Buy Subnautica 2” on?

KairuByte,
@KairuByte@lemmy.dbzer0.com avatar

Yes

Fizz,
@Fizz@lemmy.nz avatar

Everyday up until it releases

ripcord, (edited )
@ripcord@lemmy.world avatar

What about after it releases? How will I know to keep not buying it?

HugeNerd,

Shat about after it releases?

Sure, but maybe not in public?

echodot,

It’s not coming out until 2026. It’s probably unhealthy to hold it in that long.

ripcord,
@ripcord@lemmy.world avatar

Gooooood point

victorz,

Yup, that title was pure brain fuck.

Onyxonblack, do gaming w I'm still in full denial, personally.

I’m 45 and have been playing games relentlessly for 30 years now. My hands are destroyed. I can barely use controllers, my thumbs hardly work. Can’t click the space bar the arthritis is so bad. Hades and Sekiro were major culprits, button-mashing and parry precision intensity. I still play of course but it’s difficult, slow, and I just can’t play those high-action twitch reflex games anymore. Good thing there is endless games that are easier on the hands!

truxnell, do games w I am working on a turn-based wargame, influenced by the old Win3.x era WinWar 2 game

I’m thrilled were still making games like this.

Lembot_0004,

Not sure if that is sarcasm or not. But if it is: we actually have plenty games “like this”. Look at the Civilization. Yes, they are more 3d nowadays, but essentially it is still good old moving units over hexagons.

victorz,

I don’t think it was sarcasm. 🙂❤️

Worstdriver, do gaming w I'm still in full denial, personally.

59 years old today and still in denial.

From Atari’s Combat, through Tribes, and now Helldivers, the gaming goes on. There may come a day when I put away my mouse and controller …

BUT IT IS NOT THIS DAY!

missingno, (edited ) do games w The Steam controller was ahead of its time
@missingno@fedia.io avatar

No d-pad is an instant dealbreaker.

Edit: Y'know what I'll properly expand on this. The Steam Controller failed because it tried to replace vital functionality people expect from a controller. The Steam Deck learned from this mistake and just supplemented that functionality.

TBH, the way I see it, the Steam Controller was designed for games I don't want to play on controller, while being bad for games I do want to play on controller.

atomicpoet,

That’s the key. If you’re wanting to play something like Street Fighter VI, the Steam controller probably won’t fly.

But because I wanted to play Dungeon Siege on my TV, it works far better than a traditional controller ever could.

For the Steam controller to work for you, you have to come in with the mentality of it replacing a keyboard-and-mouse.

afansfw,

They’ve made it too niche, basically just fps and rts pad. I loved mine for Rocket league but was really missing the right stick. And the shoulder buttons were super stiff. And you also absolutely had to set up controls because it was so different and the pads were atrocious replacements for dpad or sticks

atomicpoet,

Hey, the Steam controller is good for one other kind of game I play quite often: Diablo-style hack-'n-slash RPGs that are mouse-driven.

afansfw,

Ok, valid! But it’s basically same controls as rts tbh

TurtleMelon,
@TurtleMelon@lemmy.dbzer0.com avatar

For me it mostly excels in games that were designed exclusively for mouse and keyboard. Ime it’s pretty bad for fps games though, maybe if you used the gyro, but I haven’t tried that much personally. I love it for Rimworld, Dwarf Fortress, and lots of little indie games that don’t have gamepad support ootb.

dualpad,

It’s absolutely fantastic for FPS. I use it for games like Doom Eternal and The Finals.

TheEntity,

That last paragraph is on point. That’s why I have two controllers at my desk, one regular and one Steam Controller! I love playing casual Civilization or XCOM on it and it’s surprisingly great with some FromSoftware games, especially Sekiro (for no reason in particular, it just felt good and the touchpad worked without any issues).

acosmichippo,
@acosmichippo@lemmy.world avatar

agreed to all of the above. I also found the texture on the trackpads to be quite irritating after a while.

Goodeye8,

Honestly, IMO the lack of D-pad was less of an issue than the lack of a second analog stick. The lack of a second stick made the controller almost impossible to use in any game that was designed with 2 sticks in mind. For example Nier Automata 9S hacking minigame was a horrible experience with the Steam controller.

dualpad,

One tip that could make twin stick experience better on the touchpads is to bring down the range where the joystick does max output. That makes it much more responsive over default where twin joysticks do not need small granular movement. Ramblecan has video covering it. www.youtube.com/watch?v=LXC2f_dD0g0

samus12345,
@samus12345@sh.itjust.works avatar

It walked so the Steam Deck could run.

bitjunkie,

It has a D-pad, though…

missingno,
@missingno@fedia.io avatar

Where?

Nalivai,

The left touch zone is pressable, and four zones are four separate buttons. It’s a bit less convenient to use than a regular d-pad, it’s bigger and you need to reach slightly further, but other than that it works.

missingno,
@missingno@fedia.io avatar

That is not a d-pad. That is a touchpad with a plus drawn on it.

Nalivai,

It’s actually the other way around, it’s a big d-pad with touchpad capabilities plastered over it. It’s the same physical mechanism as a d-pad, 4-way button, it’s just big.

jeeva,

If you don’t count arbitrary clusters of buttons as a d-pad, I think this is an invalid comparison.

Do you count, e.g., the A/B/X/Y buttons as a d-pad?

Nalivai,

D-pad for me, functionally, is a 4 directional buttons clustered together, oriented along the X-Y axis. To conserve parts, it’s quite often made not as 4 buttons but as a combined shifter, because you realistically wouldn’t be pressing the opposite buttons at the same time.
The left track area on the steam controller is that. The buttons are fuzed together (which is normal for D-pad) and big and harder to tell apart (which is less normal)

Mohamad20ZX,

Thanks For Your Amazing Reply Missingno

dualpad,

If the Steam Controller was designed the way lot of people wanted it than it wouldn’t have been a Steam Controller and just another Xbox or Playstation controller and added nothing new. Would have been more successful but in the end another generic twin joystick controller. So even if it didn’t succeed it brought new things to the table like touch activated gyro and touch pads that could be considered for other controllers in the future.

darthelmet,

Agreed on it being a bad replacement for controller games. I got one around the time one of the FROMSOFT games came out (I think it was Sekiro?) and I tried using for that and it was just not usable for something like that. I haven’t really tried it for anything else since then because I don’t really play games away from my PC, so I don’t have a need for a worse but acceptable way to play M+KB games.

GeneralEmergency,

Yeah, but counter point.

It’s got Steam branding.

Another win for the good guys.

otp,

Why are Valve the good guys?

FlexibleToast,

Because they’ve been good guys so far. They made PC gaming so much easier and have pushed linux into the mainstream.

Viking_Hippie,

Because the Cult of Gaben says so.

sugar_in_your_tea,

Yeah, I consider them “better guys,” since they’re better than their competitors. I say this because:

  • they firmly support Linux, which was my platform of choice before Steam came to it
  • they have useful Greeks features like Steam input
  • they have a good refund policy
GeneralEmergency,

I was being sarcastic.

Valve are monopolistic, popularised micro transactions, directly profit from loot boxes and gambling.

If gamers weren’t so brainwashed and Stockholmed syndromed they would realise that.

otp,

Definitely needed the /s there. I’m sure you saw the 3 or so other comments who were explaining why Valve are good guys, lol

GeneralEmergency,

That’s why I don’t put the /s there. Always draws out the Stockholmed masses.

dualpad,

It didn’t fail because of a lack of a dpad but because of lack of two joysticks, but I’m glad the controller exists because I came to absolutely love the dual touchpads. And I wouldn’t trade the left touchpad a dpad, since I like using it for movement.

I wouldn’t trade the right touchpad for a joystick either, since I like using it to do quick 180s, quick swap between 5-10 inputs to bypass reloading in games like Doom Eternal by setting a dpad modeshift on a click, and touch activate gyro all on one touchpad.

Will probably be the last controller of its kind but I’m glad at least one did get made, since otherwise I’d still just be using a xbox or playstation controller like I did before getting Steam Controller.

fuckwit_mcbumcrumble,

since I like using it for movement.

At least the basic movement from that video could easily be done with a regular joystick, it’s just the developer chose to not implement it.

dualpad,

It could but I prefer it over joystick because large touchpad makes it so its easier to not accidentally activate sprint on the outer edge.

But, the biggest part is being able to use the touchpad clicks for added move sets like dash, slide, crouch. Which lot of people wouldn’t even enjoy doing with joystick click.

sugar_in_your_tea,

Exactly, I’d rather lose a D-Pad than a joystick, and the Steam Controller lost both. That’s why my Steam Controller sits on my desk largely unused, while my PS4 controller gets all the love (I prefer XBox controllers, but PS4 has better Linux support).

I’d love to see the Steam Deck controller be made standalone, it’s super comfy and preserves both joysticks and the d-pad while having useful trackpads.

dualpad,

Sad thing is for me I don’t find the touchpads on the Deck useful, since unlike most users of the Deck I want to use them for movement and camera and quick input switching. And I haven’t found the Deck touchpads good for primary use in place of joysticks, so I end up ignoring the touchpads on the Deck for the joysticks despite using my Steam Controller for most games on the desktop.

sugar_in_your_tea,

I use them for point and click games and other games where a mouse is better.

dualpad,

I’m a controller player so it might be why I warmed up to it when it first came out, since I went from using Xbox controller on the PC to being blown away by touchpads moving as fast as a mouse without joystick speed limitation while being able to aim precisely with gyro without having to use aim assist.

So maybe an outlier as a PC gamer who preferred gamepads to mouse and keyboard, but wanted to find an improved method of using controller without reliance on aim assist.

sugar_in_your_tea,

I also prefer controllers (grew up playing Halo on controller), and gyro aim is sweet, but touchpads never felt good to me. I like physical buttons for d-pad style input (even a joystick is fine), and the right touchpad felt too much like a mouse to the point where I’d rather just use a mouse.

The Steam Deck strikes the right balance for me. The touchpads work when the mouse really is preferable, and they stay out of the way when I use the joysticks.

dualpad,

I like touchpads because I like being able to turn the camera as fast as I can swipe like a mouse while retaining X and Y axis control unlike stuff like the flick stick approach. And I like that I can also click up, down, left, right, center and also hold the left grip to set up chords for an additional 5 inputs for a total of 10 I can quickly change to without having to reach down to the facebuttons.

And that’s where the Deck fell short for me because I didn’t find it good for that type of functionality I want to use the trackpads for compared to users who primarily use the sticks.

pycorax,

Yea the only target audience for the Steam Controller seems to be people who want to play kbm games with a controller if they’re playing on a TV or something. But I reckon most PC gamers who get a controller use it to play on their usual PC setup for games that play better on a controller, they’ll just use kbm for their kbm games.

a_wild_mimic_appears,

I agree that not including the D-Pad was a bad move, but if you play games that use the d-pad just for functions like map or switching of equipment, there was the option to use the trackpad like a weapon wheel where you could define i think 8 functions with OSD, and using one of the back buttons made that 16 functions you could define freely - you could replace the hotkeys of a game that used half the keyboard with this thing lol

Nalivai,

The touch zone is the d-pad, it’s pressable and you don’t need to do anything, just use it regularly

a_wild_mimic_appears,

i know that it’s configured as a D-pad by default, but it’s missing haptic feedback - there’s not enough of an indicator where on the touchpad your finger rests, and if you lose the central position, have fun finding it again without looking. i often tried it. but it’s simply inadequate as a D-pad.

Nalivai,

I didn’t say it was a good d-pad

Nalivai,

It actually has d-pad, it’s just combined with one of the touch areas, you can press it like a button, and 4 zones behave like a d-pad. Granted, it’s a bit inconvenient so if you need it often, it’s not the best. But it’s there.

Blackmist,

Yeah, it seemed to be for a time when controller support on PC was shit.

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