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stagen, do gaming w Baldur’s Gate 3 is Causing Some Developers to Panic
@stagen@feddit.dk avatar

Honestly I hope this does indeed set a new gold standard. Probably not with the whole early access thing, though. It’s a thing that needs to go away.

pixel,
@pixel@beehaw.org avatar

EA is an immensely useful tool for game devs, the issue is EA as an excuse to ship unpolished games or to leave games unfinished forever. Neither of which are problems intrinsic to early access, they’re just bad business practice that should be shunned like any other

soulsource,
@soulsource@discuss.tchncs.de avatar

As a gamedev: Early Access was useful for devs, back when it was real Early Access. Think: Kerbal Space Program (the first, not the second).

Nowadays it’s mostly a marketing tool, that allows to generate the hype for launch twice… Publishers and players expect “Early Access” games to be feature complete and polished before the “Early Access” launch…

Maultasche,

I liked what Daemon X Machina did, where they released a demo, sent out questionnaires to everyone who downloaded it, published a video about the results save how they were planning to act on it, and a few months later released a new demo with a new questionnaire.

soulsource,
@soulsource@discuss.tchncs.de avatar

Yep, that’s probably the most helpful thing for devs. This sadly often conflicts with publishers’ announcement schedules. There are, however, companies that do NDA-protected play-tests, where you get the same kind of information, without publicly announcing the game.

Appoxo,
@Appoxo@lemmy.dbzer0.com avatar

Ubisoft did (does?) it to a degree with their Rainbow 6 TTS (beta) servers to test the sandbox and did so for a few technical alpha/beta releases acting as selected pewviews to see how the game is received and where bugs are.

Nalivai,

And again, Larian Studios used EA as intended, which allowed them to publish a good, polished game.

stopthatgirl7,
!deleted7120 avatar

As did Supergiant, with Hades. When Early Access is used properly, it can help make a great game.

TauriWarrior,

Early access worked well for them, part of the start of the game was able to be play tested, the community got to give feedback, and they actually listened, its how it should be done

Appoxo,
@Appoxo@lemmy.dbzer0.com avatar

Yeah but not how the remaining whole industry treats it.
I saw literally no outcry regarding BG3 and early game bugs. Comparing it to CP2077 it was a stellar release in terms of PR.

Lojcs,

CP2077 didn’t have early access tho? How is this an argument against early access

Kolanaki,
!deleted6508 avatar

I don’t think Early Access should go away as it’s not inherently bad in and of itself.

What’s bad about it is when it’s used to sell a totally unfinished piece of shit that stays an unfinished piece of shit indefinitely.

rich, do games w Quake II - Official Trailer (2023)

Been playing Quake 1 with the pc VR mod, which was an experience. Hoping quake 2 gets the same

Rozauhtuno, do gaming w Baldur’s Gate 3 is Causing Some Developers to Panic
@Rozauhtuno@lemmy.blahaj.zone avatar

Oh no, if people remember that games are supposed to be good, no one will buy our lootbox-infested crap anymore.

Good.

ampersandrew,
@ampersandrew@kbin.social avatar

Loot boxes are so 2017. It's all about battle passes, engagement, and player retention now.

Kolanaki,
!deleted6508 avatar

You know what creates engagement and retains players?

Making a good game that’s actually fun to play instead of focusing on how you’re gonna sell me hats and paint jobs and weaponizing FOMO.

ampersandrew,
@ampersandrew@kbin.social avatar

Sorry, but the other methods are demonstrably better at it. We didn't arrive at them by accident. There are outliers like Civilization keeping people hooked for years; the people still playing Skullgirls all these years later sure aren't doing it for any type of reward system. But the fast track to keeping people playing your game is to use all the scummy bullshit.

Lowbird,

I wonder why they haven’t tried the model airport books and comics use, though. We could do it with games at this point. Like, make a series of games that are low budget, relatively short, and easy to pump out very quickly, but with a distinct series identity and maybe a consistent writer/artist across games. Then make a lot of them and get people hooked on the series instead of on 1 mega game.

Even just text adventure style games, wireframe arcade style games, bullethells, shooters like Vampire Survivor & etc, visual novels, syuff like Undertale, whatever? I think it’s clear that a low budget or small team doesn’t equate to unpopularity these days, if the game is made with care and attention to detail.

We do have series now but they’re high budget and long and kind of also trying to be the 1 mega game at the same time.

There’s also a lot of options for reaching new/underserved audience. Like. Make a high quality horse game for once, please? And profit off a bazillion horse girls who’ve been waiting for just that for decades.

Or make games for other countries that don’t have a big video games market yet, maybe. Like sell a console real cheap, at a loss, and then sell games in an area where there’s less competition? Maybe.

ampersandrew,
@ampersandrew@kbin.social avatar

I wonder why they haven’t tried the model airport books and comics use, though. We could do it with games at this point. Like, make a series of games that are low budget, relatively short, and easy to pump out very quickly, but with a distinct series identity and maybe a consistent writer/artist across games. Then make a lot of them and get people hooked on the series instead of on 1 mega game.

I think that's exactly what Fortnite and Destiny 2 do, even though I object to the way they do it for so many reasons.

Trainguyrom,

Like, make a series of games that are low budget, relatively short, and easy to pump out very quickly, but with a distinct series identity and maybe a consistent writer/artist across games. Then make a lot of them and get people hooked on the series instead of on 1 mega game.

Urban Games currently does this with Transport Fever. They flat out said while hyping the release of Transport Fever 2 (which was their third transport tycoon style game) that their goal as a development studio is to make the best transportation tycoon game they can. So they intend to continuously iterate.

N3V Games, who developes the Trainz simulator game was literally formed to buy up the property and talent from its original developer Auran and continue the franchise

There’s a third example I was going to give but got distracted while writing this comment and forgot

ezures,

One example might be Fnaf (before security breach or help wanted), since they are relatively simple, short games made by one guy, not on high budget. Most of them launched like 3-6 months after each other, keeping up interest in the series.

Something big aaa games also miss is the creativity, since a cool gimick can be implemented as a main mechanic in a 1-2 hour game, since it doesnt over stay its welcome.

So yeah, most games are getting too long for their own good (like ubi sandbox games), not to mention the ‘games as a service’ games.

t3rmit3,

a series of games that are low budget, relatively short, and easy to pump out very quickly, but with a distinct series identity and maybe a consistent writer/artist across games

Telltale has entered (and exited) the chat.

acastcandream,

As much as I prefer this model that actually isn’t what creates engagement and retains players over several games and years. They don’t do it because it’s fun to make predatory things. They do it because it makes them heaps of money. If it didn’t work, they wouldn’t do it. That’s the sad truth here.

Re: hats and paint jobs…hats dominated TF2 for how long? There was a black market and widespread scamming for cosmetics, that’s how nuts it got.

Lowbird,

I wonder if the TF2 “buds” item is still used as a game-trading currency.

Valliac,
@Valliac@beehaw.org avatar

But however will the poor shareholders get their value this quarter?

Someone think of the shareholders!

eskimofry,

Oh I am thinking of them… how to murder shareholders in various unique ways… could be neat game idea too!

prole,

people remember that games are supposed to be good

I’ve played a lot of great games in the past few years 🤷‍♂️

recursive_recursion, do games w BIONICLE: Masks of Power - Demo Trailer
@recursive_recursion@programming.dev avatar

damn a new Bionicle product

I thought it would never happen in my lifetime
pog

zer0, do games w Quake II - Official Trailer (2023)

Closed source spyware by microsoft. Just play Xonotic or Nexuiz

ezures,

Lmao, they actually released the source code

zer0,

Excellent, make sure not to use closed launchers to play this

Magrath, do gaming w Baldur’s Gate 3 is Causing Some Developers to Panic

Click baiting video. Other devs don’t care. As long as they can make money pumping out mediocre games then they will continue to do so. Acting like this is the first good game to come out in a decade or something.

DrM,

DEVs do care. As a developer working on something you want to be proud of it. Publishers do not care.

bionicjoey,

Looking at how many games have stood in Dragon Age: Origins’ shadow over the past decade, I get the sense that lots of studios wanted to create the true spiritual successor but couldn’t come up with the resources to do so.

storksforlegs,
@storksforlegs@beehaw.org avatar

Or if not lacking resources, definitely lacking the creative freedom.

Kolanaki,
!deleted6508 avatar

The individuals working on the game might care.

The managers who make the decisions don’t. Doesn’t matter if they are a publisher or the development company itself. It’s a bit blurry these days anyway, what with how easy it is to self publish and how many publishers have their own internal development studios.

Ilflish,

The managers who make the decisions is also unclear as power differs on the company. They could care all the way up to the CEO but if the CEO puts an unrealistic deadline, the game has an unrealistic deadline

lowdownfool, do gaming w Baldur’s Gate 3 is Causing Some Developers to Panic
@lowdownfool@kbin.social avatar

Is there something I can read instead of giving some jackass a view on Youtube?

Goronmon,

To summarize the actual tweets/comments/etc that these videos (there are multiple) are panicking about.

  1. Smaller studios aren't going to be able to replicate the scale and complexity of BG3. So people shouldn't be using BG3 as the bar to compare future titles/RPGs from other studios going forward. Larian is comparable in size (or even larger) to Bethesda when they released Skyrim, and no one has been able to compete directly with Skyrim either.
  2. Not all games and RPGs need to be as complex and long as BG3. Expecting open-ended, 100 hour-long RPGs for every future game/RPG isn't realistic. Not all games require that scope, it's rare to get such a budget for this type of game, and even if you did, most companies won't be able to replicate the game in a meaningful way. Just like how companies other than Rockstar would struggle to replicate the scale of games like GTA and RDR.

There, I've summarized multiple 20 min videos. Just without all the hand-waving and drama.

stopthatgirl7,
!deleted7120 avatar

So, I see you definitely didn’t actually watch the video.

Goronmon,

I did, did you?

stopthatgirl7,
!deleted7120 avatar

Considering I’m the one who posted it, yes.

Goronmon,

You would be far from the only person who has posted a link to an article/video they have never read/watched.

jeebus,
@jeebus@kbin.social avatar

It was a pretty good video with a good message. All the more surprising is that it was from IGN.

lowdownfool,
@lowdownfool@kbin.social avatar

I prefer not to sit through a 10 minute video for something that requires less than a minute reading time.

raccoona_nongrata, do gaming w Baldur’s Gate 3 is Causing Some Developers to Panic
@raccoona_nongrata@beehaw.org avatar

deleted_by_author

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  • SnepKayz,

    Star Citizen is its own greatest obstacle lol. Doesn’t need a shadowy cabal of all the major game studios conspiring to keep it down.

    AlexisFR,
    @AlexisFR@jlai.lu avatar

    Well it’s main competitor also collapsed on it self, maybe it’s just hard to do?

    Borat,
    @Borat@lemmynsfw.com avatar

    main competitor also collapsed on it self

    Elite Dangerous is alive and well, thank you. I still play it.

    shiveyarbles, do gaming w Baldur’s Gate 3 is Causing Some Developers to Panic

    BG 3 is so stupid, it’s not even optimizing micro transactions for maximum profits

    forgotaboutlaye,

    How am I supposed to feel a sense of pride and accomplishment without paying for my dice rolls?

    orbitz,

    Wonder what a divine crit roll would cost, $5 in combat $3 outside? Heck that’s too complicated $10 for all, $7 for season pass holders.

    For those wondering there is no season pass.

    Kolanaki,
    !deleted6508 avatar

    They would have to also start charging to save scum. Why would I pay $5 for a crit when I can just reload my save and try until I get one? Every new save is $0.50 and every reload is also $0.50.

    reverendsteveii,

    Fuck it, exiting the game now costs $2. We need to recoup the opportunity cost of you not being somewhere you can be directly marketed to.

    AdmiralShat,

    Unity CEO has entered the chat

    ours,

    “Leaving money on the table” must be the exec’s perspective.

    sterno900, do games w Titan Quest II | Announcement Trailer

    This is legendary

    Hubi, do games w Gothic 1 Remake | Welcome to the Old Camp | Showcase Trailer 2023

    I’m really looking forward to this game. Brings me right back to my childhood!

    genfood, do games w Titan Quest II | Announcement Trailer
    @genfood@feddit.de avatar

    Supported by the Federal Ministry of Transport and Digital Infrastructure Germany

    McChessers, do games w SOUTH PARK: SNOW DAY! | Reveal Trailer

    Did we learn nothing from the terrible N64 game?

    prim3r,

    Last couple south park game were pretty good. Decent enough games, but enough south park humour to make them enjoyable for fans. Can’t speak to the n64 game though.

    BruceTwarzen,

    As far as i remember the games back then were pretty shit, because they just told random game studios to make South park games. The games were just clones of other games like mario kart. (I did like that dumb ps1 game tho) and trey and matt weren't really happy with it so they "made their own" starting with stick of truth. That's why there was a sudden shift in quality.

    xePBMg9, do games w SOUTH PARK: SNOW DAY! | Reveal Trailer

    Reminds me of the PSX south park game where you could throw yellow slow balls. Don’t remember much else from the game though.

    Karza, do gaming w Baldur’s Gate 3 is Causing Some Developers to Panic

    And that’s a bad thing because?

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